JBfrom wrote:

How are there not any
other Org-mode users on this forum? Carsten must suck them all over to his place, never
to stray... or even fantasize.

A probable answer is the learning curve; I think someone who tried it out recently wrote that he spent more time memorising keystrokes than focusing on the actual work.

InfoQube can also do most --probably all- of the things mentioned here too, and much more, including number crunching. Yet two years after registering the software I haven't brought myself to actually learn it, though I know well it will be worth it. Power comes at a cost.

JBfrom wrote:

How are there not any
other Org-mode users on this forum? Carsten must suck them all over to his place, never
to stray... or even fantasize.

Emacs. User Experience. Need we say anything more :).

While developers are a huge subset of what might be considered a "market" for users needing outlining capabilities, the GrandViews of the world never targeted developers or refined capabilities for them. It was a much broader audience that needed a much different user experience. Well, one like GrandView. :).

Peace
F

True that. Still, I'm surprised there isn't at least one other person.

I'm pretty sure Xah Lee's distro takes care of most of the keybind problem. I should beef up my Emacs tutorial section.

Aha, but does InfoQube have a fully integrated spreadsheet app? *Infinite power!*, screams the villain, right before his head explodes.

JBfrom wrote:

Aha, but does InfoQube have a fully integrated spreadsheet app?

Good question ! No is the answer.

The concept behind IQ is not to replace standard apps (MSWord, Excel, etc). If the best tool is a spreadsheet, then use a spreadsheet. IQ does shows the information as a grid (+1 for IQ vs Excel since it is a tree-grid), you can define equations and you can do some formatting. But Excel is much more free-form. Each cell can have any equation.

IQ can be seen as a cross between Excel and Access (but this is an imperfect picture of course)

In IQ, equations are defined at the field level (i.e. grid columns) and are enforced at the database level (in Excel, it is done at the presentation level: the grid)

HTH !

Pierre
IQ Designer

JBfrom wrote:

True that. Still, I'm surprised there isn't at least one other person.

Well actually, I think there is:
http://www.outlinersoftware.com/topics/viewt/986/0/org-mode-for-gtd

That said, you should keep in mind that more people frequent this forum than actually write in it. When such 'spectators' eventually do write, they often provide very fresh approaches; i.e. more than just new apps, I mean new viewpoints about using the apps. So I wouldn't take what's already written --and there's a damn lot- as completely representative of what is actually happening.

Aha, but does InfoQube have a fully integrated
spreadsheet app?

And org-mode does? Truthfully, it still wouldn't tempt me, but I'm just wondering. I like the text screen mode for writing, but I wouldn't want to go back to visicalc.

Yes indeed it does: http://orgmode.org/manual/The-spreadsheet.html

Personally I use the tables feature only for exporting clocked work data.

I've accepted that right now nobody who doesn't already use Org-mode can possibly be convinced to try Cyborganize.

I must commune with my fellow nerds.

I like the way very old threads can be come back to life here. This was a good one. Enjoyed reading through it.

Choosing an information manager is a big decision ... you don't want to invest a lot of time learning a program unless you have an idea that the program is THE one you want to put your life into. Like Alexander, I have Infoqube thinking it might be the one, but I haven't found the time to really get deeply into it. Org-Mode also intrigues me but it seems even more daunting.

jim

The nice thing about Emacs Org-mode is there's never a limit to the value you can get out of investing more time into learning it.

The reward/learning curve goes flat on most programs, and you're left fiddling with frustrating hacked-up workarounds.

With Emacs, every year you get better. It's like having a symbiotic brain pet. Personal customization is literally unlimited.

For a starting point, get a windows keybind distro and just use the basic outlining functions within a single file.

I haven't posted in a while, but I'm also an Org-mode user.

I don't think that Org-mode is any harder to learn than old-style DOS apps like Grandview, particularly if you rely on the menu system rather than trying to memorize keystrokes. (Remember, the old DOS apps often tended to have different shortcuts for cut and paste and things like that... often very counterintuitive ones like Wordperfect's shift-F7 to exit... it wasn't until graphical environments that common keyboard shortcuts tended to be standardized.)

I also find that Org-mode does have that "Zen" simplicity that DOS tools used to have. Once you go fullscreen, there are so many fewer distractions than most applications... it's a nice writing environment. And it's unbelievably powerful and customizable if you decide that you need something out of the ordinary.

That said, I don't use Org-mode for everything. Although it is capable of building personal wikis, I prefer Dokuwiki for a variety of reasons. ConnectedText 5 is fantastic too, and a good alternative (it does some things better than DW and other things DW does better). I've never really understood the point of Tiddlywiki... anything it can do would probably be best just left in Org-mode, and if one needs a full-blown wiki, why not go with a full-blown wiki? Also, while the underlying calendaring features of Org-mode are perfect, its lack of a graphical calendar view makes it more suited for task management IMHO. (Yes, ongoing iCalendar export is an option, but then it's not perfectly integrated and you don't get alarms.)

-- Chris

JBfrom wrote:

The nice thing about Emacs Org-mode is there's never a limit to the value you can get out
of investing more time into learning it.

The reward/learning curve goes flat on
most programs, and you're left fiddling with frustrating hacked-up workarounds.


With Emacs, every year you get better. It's like having a symbiotic brain pet.
Personal customization is literally unlimited.

For a starting point, get a
windows keybind distro and just use the basic outlining functions within a single
file.

"I?ve never really understood the point of Tiddlywiki? anything it can do would probably be best just left in Org-mode, and if one needs a full-blown wiki, why not go with a full-blown wiki?"

TiddlyWiki is indeed not a good choice for the traditional use case of a wiki - a collaborative knowledge management platform. However, the Cyborganize T1 repository is not a traditional use case.

I chose it for several reasons, after looking at DokuWiki, ConnectedText, and many others:
1. Easy local installation
2. Blazing fast navigation
3. High extensibility
4. With plugins, can avoid almost all markup and write with TinyMCEditor, which copies directly to WordPress.
5. Easy to setup automatic hierarchical navigation
6. Handles all forms of media and files
7. Minor WikiWords annoyances can be patched over
8. 100% cross platform with zero porting or emulation... can be carried on a USB
9. Fluid desktop environment is handy for writers

Markup was the main issue. It is simply impossible as a writer to deal with the challenges of composition while constantly interrupting oneself to write formatting code. And it is impractical to retype existing documents just to get them into a wiki.

Chris Thompson wrote:

I haven't posted in a while, but I'm also an Org-mode user.

I don't think that
Org-mode is any harder to learn than old-style DOS apps like Grandview,

Hi Chris.

Hope u r well.

I think the VIM contingent just rolled over and died :)

IMHO ....

Channel Joe Consumer in front of EMACS. Suzy Admin. Frank Executive. Channel it baby. I have seen these "types" consume outliners back in the day. If they started using EMACS then I think all support desks would no longer be necessary :)

Take care