I have really ramped up the number of projects I am working on for both myself and my clients.

For some time I have used Gqueues, and I love the simple interface, but there is no time tracking.

What project management software have other Outliner members found to be useful? I don't mind paying a reasonable monthly fee for the right one.

Thanks,

Garland Coulson wrote:

What project management software have other Outliner members found to be
useful?

Check out this thread:
http://www.outlinersoftware.com/topics/viewt/3945/0/best-pim-for-project-management

It really depends on what your specific needs are, as there is such a wide variety of PM tools out there as well as PIM that can be adopted.

Most recently I've been using RationalPlan for making quick Gantt charts and WorkFlowy for developing and tracking detailed tasks. I still keep an overall project plan in MindSystems Amode V2.

Sorry to cop out (partially), but it depends on the nature of the project. The answers to several questions are needed to help define the requirements of your software, such as, in random order: How complex (i.e. how many tasks?) are your projects? Do you need to collaborate with other team members? Do you need to plan the work of other team members? Do you need to communicate 'upstairs' or with clients, with pretty diagrams and Ganntt charts? Do your projects need to be accurately costed? Does your project management software need to communicate with task management software, and/or with project management software on tablets or smartphone devices? How much can you afford to spend? How much time can you afford to devote to learning the ins and outs of particular programmes (this can be significant if you're unfamiliar with them)? Are you on a Mac or PC? etc. etc.

When I started using project management software, something like twenty-plus years ago, there was only one programme: Microsoft Project, on Windows. It's expensive by the standards of most software we talk about on this forum (though certainly not the most expensive project management software available, which can cost £000's), it was, and is, based around Ganntt charts (check on Wikipedia, if you need to know what these are), it was then a pig to use, but now I expect it's much better, and it has effectively set the standards for many others, including most for the Mac. I used it for both commercial and personal projects. I no longer use it because I'm now on a Mac, but I believe it's still going strong.

Since MS Project launched, several trends have become evident. There have been new Windows Ganntt-based programmes introduced, some task-management programmes, such as My Life Organized, have started edging into the project management market, as have mind mappers like Mind Manager and Nova, and new desktop Mac programmes, such as Merlin, Omniplan and SG Project Pro (all of which I've used - for small freelance projects I prefer Omniplan), have emerged. Most strikingly, two other recent changes are evident to anyone Googling 'project management'. First, there is a growing number of web-based project management applications, almost all designed for teams, but some of which are effectively free of charge for a one-person band. They are especially useful if you want to be able look at your plan via a browser on a tablet or smartphone. Second, there are new philosophies of project management that effectively dispense with Mr Ganntt's invention. These include 'agile project management', 'scrum' and the kanban board (all defined on Wikipedia if you feel the need). One 'kanban' web app that I like is Trello, but there are many that are similar. Mac users can build a kanban board on their desktops with Curio, or, less expensively, with any sticky notes application - or what I sometimes resort to, a whiteboard and Post-Its!

Good luck!

Two additional thoughts.

First, I can't spell 'Gantt'.

Second, what do you mean by 'time tracking'? Most Gantt-chart based applications will enable you to record actual progress against the plan, and indicate resulting knock-ons. Anything more automated might require a dedicated time-tracking application.

Personally, I've found the best use for project management applications is to keep an overview of all concurrent projects, evolving over time, enabling you to see where their plans conflict and where you have spare time, with resultant impacts on their end-dates. In other words, they provide a useful dose of 'reality'.

Dr Andus wrote:

Most recently I've been using RationalPlan

I too use RationalPlan (the multiple project version). I find it to be a good balance of power and ease of use. With some caveats (learning curve and the need to turn off both working hours and working days to make the gantt chart work correctly), InfoQube is very good for this purpose too.

There are many choices. It depends on your needs.

Jon

Hi there,

An intestesting round-up of project management tools here : https://www.udemy.com/blog/project-management-tools/

Cheers /jerome

Dr Andus wrote:

It really depends on what your specific needs are, as there is such a
wide variety of PM tools out there as well as PIM that can be adopted.

Most recently I've been using RationalPlan for making quick Gantt charts
and WorkFlowy for developing and tracking detailed tasks. I still keep
an overall project plan in MindSystems Amode V2.

Thanks Dr Andus,

I am becoming a real fan of web based systems for tools that need collaboration like project management. It looks like RationalPlan is desktop software rather than cloud-based? I see Workflowy is more of an outliner than a project management system.

I do use Noteliner for outlines, but need something more robust for managing projects.

Hugh wrote:

Second, what do you mean by 'time tracking'? Most Gantt-chart based
applications will enable you to record actual progress against the plan,
and indicate resulting knock-ons. Anything more automated might require
a dedicated time-tracking application.

Primarily, I want to determine the profit at the end of a client project. So if I and my team each track our time, and I can see how long each person has spent on the project, I can see if I am pricing the projects correctly.

So it would be nice if we could just click on a timer button when working on a task and the time gets added to that task and project.

Currently testing LiquidPlanner and Planbox which both seem to do this.

You might want to try Org-mode. Org has a sophisticated system for clocking time, etc. and Org is a wonderful single pane outliner. Org-mode is a major mode of Gnu-Emacs which is free and available on all major operating systems.

John

Have found Plan For Windows to work rather well. Compatible with MS Project. Largest project was only 1200 items 64 resources over a 2 year time frame. Only basic reporting, can handle multiple resources, gnatt and of course depenancies. Can be found here



very reasonable price (sub $50 usd)

SureTrak v2 & 3 prior to Oracle buy was used for larger projects, better reporting etc. Have not upgraded in a long time (still WinXP based), not sure if Win7 compat.

Org mode is used for daily/monthly or slightly larger 'projects' sub 100 items. Could be used for larger, but have not done so myself. Great non OS locked, text based items. No gnatt mode to my limited knowledge.

Garland Coulson wrote:

It looks like RationalPlan is
desktop software rather than cloud-based?

Yes, it's a simple, no-nonsense desktop PM software, but it sounds like it could do the things you described (it can email tasks to collaborators and I recall there might be a free project file viewer for others).

I see Workflowy is more of an

outliner than a project management system.

No, I wasn't suggesting Workflowy as a PM system. It's more for ad hoc task development ("work breakdown structure") during the implementation of the project. Such as when you realise while you're carrying it out that the task you planned is actually composed of another 10 tasks etc., etc., or that a different task is required altogether.

Rather than messing with my big project plan in RationalPlan at this small level of detail, I just use Workflowy. Incidentally, since my project has to do with writing, there is an overlap between the task management function and actual outlining, which is why Workflowy is particularly suitable.

But my PM needs are very basic, mostly I'm just managing myself, as an academic...

johnmcde wrote:

You might want to try Org-mode. Org has a sophisticated system for
clocking time, etc. and Org is a wonderful single pane outliner.
Org-mode is a major mode of Gnu-Emacs which is free and available on all
major operating systems.

John

I looked at Org-mode four or five years ago. Learning it appeared likely to demand time that I could not then afford. Maybe this was simply because it didn't seem to be in the MS-Project type of framework with which I was familiar. Has it become more user-friendly since then?

My own favorite remains open-source prog GanttProject, which is very powerful and easy to use: one of those nice apps with "enough, and no more" (to quote Dr. Seuss).

That's when I'm not using Excel or Numbers ;-)

More at www.ganttproject.biz

Garland Coulson wrote:

Hugh wrote:

>Second, what do you mean by 'time tracking'? Most Gantt-chart based
>applications will enable you to record actual progress against the
plan,
>and indicate resulting knock-ons. Anything more automated might require
>a dedicated time-tracking application.

Primarily, I want to determine the profit at the end of a client
project. So if I and my team each track our time, and I can see how long

Look at To-Do-List http://www.abstractspoon.com/

This only tracks time, gives you spaces to describe the task and sub-tasks down to many levels. Time cost can be set-up and estimates of time to spend. You can enter things like the start date, deadline and best of all has buttons to click each time you start and end a task. It has reporting functions as well.

I use it with my team almost daily. Its very configurable and intuitive to use. Each option does what it says, can be set to start when Windows starts so always running in the background. The developer started it as a programming exercise and it does not seem very well known. It is being constantly improved, does not appear to have any bugs. You really just need to download it an start using it.

For me it's simplicity and use is' its appeal. It's FREE. By the end of the first day's use you probably know everything you need to know about it.

Jerry

Funnily enough, I was going to suggest that, too. You'll also find Android and iOS clients on the main CodeProject page (http://www.codeproject.com/Articles/5371/ToDoList-6-7-B6-Beta-Release-An-effective-and-flex

johnmcde wrote:

You might want to try Org-mode. Org has a sophisticated system for
clocking time, etc. and Org is a wonderful single pane outliner.
Org-mode is a major mode of Gnu-Emacs which is free and available on all
major operating systems.

John

Thanks John,

The Org-mode I found looked like it had an old Dos style screen and command line interface?

I am not really interested in a text based system - I like GUI. Also, I prefer cloud-based solutions so my team can log in and use it rather than desktop software.

Garland

Garland Coulson wrote:

I am not really interested in a text based system - I like GUI. Also, I
prefer cloud-based solutions so my team can log in and use it rather
than desktop software.

Check out this older thread:
http://www.outlinersoftware.com/topics/viewt/3328/0/team-solutions-2-collaborative-webspace-for-project-management

I will also try to provide some additional updated info if I find the time and head. For the moment, just two suggestions for time tracking: Toggl https://www.toggl.com/ and Klok http://www.getklok.com/ I personally use the latter, which is brilliant for showing you the day as it evolves and can export/link to several systems.

Hugh wrote:

johnmcde wrote:
You might want to try Org-mode. Org has a sophisticated system for
>clocking time, etc. and Org is a wonderful single pane outliner.
>Org-mode is a major mode of Gnu-Emacs which is free and available on
all
>major operating systems.
>
>John

I looked at Org-mode four or five years ago. Learning it appeared likely
to demand time that I could not then afford. Maybe this was simply
because it didn't seem to be in the MS-Project type of framework with
which I was familiar. Has it become more user-friendly since then?

Org-mode is part of Emacs now so you have to become comfortable with the Emacs ways of doing things. I dedicated a few function keys to more complex commands and am learning commands I need as I go along. You can use as much or as little of org-mode as you like. I looked for alternatives to Org and Emacs but keep coming back because I haven't found anything that comes close.

John

Garland Coulson wrote:

johnmcde wrote:
You might want to try Org-mode. Org has a sophisticated system for
>clocking time, etc. and Org is a wonderful single pane outliner.
>Org-mode is a major mode of Gnu-Emacs which is free and available on
all
>major operating systems.
>
>John

Thanks John,

The Org-mode I found looked like it had an old Dos style screen and
command line interface?

I am not really interested in a text based system - I like GUI. Also, I
prefer cloud-based solutions so my team can log in and use it rather
than desktop software.

Garland

That's interesting. I have the GUI version of Emacs (comes with Org-mode standard) installed. You can run Emacs from a terminal by telling emacs to load the non-gui version via the command line. The GUI version is the default on my installations. I have Emacs 24 installed on Linux and Windows, both with a GUI.

John

JerryNotts wrote:

Garland Coulson wrote:
Hugh wrote:
>
>>Second, what do you mean by 'time tracking'? Most Gantt-chart based
>>applications will enable you to record actual progress against the
>plan,
>>and indicate resulting knock-ons. Anything more automated might
require
>>a dedicated time-tracking application.
>
>Primarily, I want to determine the profit at the end of a client
>project. So if I and my team each track our time, and I can see how
long

Look at To-Do-List http://www.abstractspoon.com/

This only tracks time, gives you spaces to describe the task and
sub-tasks down to many levels. Time cost can be set-up and estimates of
time to spend. You can enter things like the start date, deadline and
best of all has buttons to click each time you start and end a task. It
has reporting functions as well.

I use it with my team almost daily. Its very configurable and intuitive
to use. Each option does what it says, can be set to start when Windows
starts so always running in the background. The developer started it as
a programming exercise and it does not seem very well known. It is being
constantly improved, does not appear to have any bugs. You really just
need to download it an start using it.

For me it's simplicity and use is' its appeal. It's FREE. By the end of
the first day's use you probably know everything you need to know about
it.

Jerry

Hello Jerry,

I must admit to being very impressed with ToDoList from Abstract Spoon. It has tasks, subtasks, time tracking, task assignment and most other things I am looking for the interface is both minimalist and powerful at the same time.

The ONLY drawback I see to this one is that it is computer based rather than cloud-based. My reasoning for cloud-based is that I have outsource people in other countries and I thought it may make sense for them to be logging to the project management system to pick up their tasks and do tracking.

However, many of them work on oDesk where they already track their time so may balk at tracking in both places, Usually they only have a few tasks at a time as well so perhaps I could use ToDoList to manage the projects myself and just enter their time for the projects weekly.

But eventually I do want a virtual assistant to talk care of a lot of this for me and at that time I think a cloud-based system would make more sense. So perhaps it would not make sense to put a lot of time and effort into learning ToDoList instead of finding the right cloud solution.



Thank you for suggesting it.

Give app.intellobuild a try http://app.intellobuild.com We currently use this tool and find it very useful.

Alexander Deliyannis wrote:

For the moment, just two suggestions for time tracking:
Toggl https://www.toggl.com/ and Klok http://www.getklok.com/ I
personally use the latter, which is brilliant for showing you the day as
it evolves and can export/link to several systems.

Thanks Alexander,

Klog and Toggl looks to be primarily time tracking tools - not really for project management. I want to plan multiple tasks and projects first, then time how long each time takes. So I want a tool that is a great project management system with time tracking rather than a great time tracking tool that can do a bit of project management.

ToDoList from Abstract Spoon is brilliant and the winner so far even though it isn't cloud based. I also liked Liquid Planner and Planbox which are cloud-based.

I've not come across Liquid Planner before. It seems rather good, thoughtfully put together, with lots of features, if expensive. Thanks.

Alexander Deliyannis wrote:

Klog and Toggl looks to be primarily time tracking tools - not really
for project management. I want to plan multiple tasks and projects
first, then time how long each time takes.

Garland, did you check out the older thread I suggested? I'd be surprised if you didn't find there a good option for the project management bit:
http://www.outlinersoftware.com/topics/viewt/3328/0/team-solutions-2-collaborative-webspace-for-project-management

So I want a tool that is a
great project management system with time tracking rather than a great
time tracking tool that can do a bit of project management.

I completely agree with your approach. In the older thread I note my own preferences for the project management bit. But I have seen no great project management system with satisfactory time tracking, so I just covered that aspect with Klok.

I am really miffed at Jerry.

He suggested ToDoList from Abstract Spoon and now I am totally hooked on it. But I really wanted a cloud-based solution so he messed me up!

Curse you, Jerry! :)