Hi fellow CRIMPers,

I'm currently working for a customer for which I have to use their own hardware (Windows laptop) for security reasons. And guess what, this machine is seriously locked down, I cannot install or run anything beyond the officially supported apps, so I decided to take that as an opportunity to review my workflow which so far was based exclusively on markdown files, using Neovim as my main editor.

So, I'm looking for a note-taking app, supporting markdown (I'm so used to it) and the key requirement is that it *must* run in a browser (not a local executable).

I was considering Roam Research as an option, I would have preferred Logseq which is open source, but apparently I have to use their app (which is provided as an executable file).

Any other suggestions?

Cheers,

Jerome

If you are using NeoVim, I'm assuming you are fairly technical? You might be able to keep your existing workflow by self-hosting NeoVim and accessing it through a browser. Cheap hosting would probably cost you less than most of the online outliners.

I can't vouch for this project, but it looks like it might work if you are up for it. https://github.com/yqlbu/neovim-server

Personally, I have always just ended up relying on a secondary device when in a locked down environment like you are in. You can email yourself stuff and set up mail rules to process it into your workflow. This is assuming that the data isn't proprietary or sensitive.

Workflowy is another option if you need a browser based outliner. https://workflowy.com

Jerome wrote:

I have to use their own hardware (Windows laptop) for security reasons. And guess what, this machine is seriously locked down, I cannot install or run anything beyond the officially supported apps (...)

W.r.t. online browser based outliner / note-taker, the first one that comes to mind is Notion. It is a great note-taking tool. Well designed. Simple to use at first, but as you learn more, it can get quite powerful.

That said, I have yet to see a PC so locked down that InfoQube Portable would not run. So this is most likely another option.
Simply unzip the app package + your data on a USB stick, or better still a mini SSD, and you'll be 100% portable, on any Windows PC.

Pierre Paul Landry
IQ Designer
Download link: https://www.infoqube.biz/download

Thanks a lot for your answers so far Maurice and Pierre-Paul. The Windows 10 laptop is completely locked: exe files will only run if they are located in the Windows program folders and I don't have write permissions on those folders. Unfortunately an exe file on a USB key will not run either (I just tried to run InfoQube to no avail).

I'll give another look at Workflowy, it's been a very long time since I last took a look at it.

Cheers,

Jerome

Wouldn't Evernote's web version work fine? Or how about Dynalist? SimpleNote might be a good option. Seems like there should be a lot of options, unless I am missing something... not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

Given that you're using NeoVim with Markdown files, I did the following search:

https://alternativeto.net/software/obsidian/?feature=markdown-support&platform=online&p=2

This searches for Obsidian alternatives that are web-based and that support Markdown. 13 alternatives are listed. A few of them look like they would meet your needs. Boostnote looks like it might most closely resemble what you're used to. (Bangle.io claims to work with local files, which sounds intriguing, although it hasn't been updated in some months.)

I would also recommend Dynalist -- as Steve Zeoli did. I have used Dynalist in a browser on Windows machines provided to me by clients, with no issues.

BUT -- big but -- make sure you understand the privacy and security policies governing that client machine. Accessing a browser-based note taking site might violate security policies -- many government agencies I've worked with track such usage to guard against data exfiltration. In might be prudent to use your personal machine next to the client's machine, as also recommended above, just to avoid issues.

May I suggest you StackEdit - In-browser Markdown editor:
https://stackedit.io/

What about something from the tiddlywiki ecosystem. There are tiddlywiki versions to mimic the look and feel of many popular note taking applications like roam. Lots of plugins to add functions. Runs locally in a browser on a thumbdrive.

I do not sue it but here are some names that I have come across.

tiddlymap
tiddlyroam
tiddlyresearch
tiddlystudy
tiddlywiki5

https://tiddlytools.com/

Similarly dokuwiki can be installed on a thumbdrive and has plugins to extend much of its functions.

Thanks a lot for the various suggestions. I'm currently experimenting with Logseq, using the web app connected to a private github repo.

So far, I like it very much and it just requires a browser as long as I don't use (nor need) the logseq app.

I'll be using this for the next couple of days...

Cheers,

Jerome

Good idea. Just note that the dev is saying Github support will be phased out once Logseq has its own sync service ready.

Lucas wrote:

Good idea. Just note that the dev is saying Github support will be
phased out once Logseq has its own sync service ready.

By "ready" do you mean it's existing already or they are ready to launch it?

I wouldn't want to invest a lot of time into figuring out how to set up Github for this, if there are other alternatives.

The ideal solution for me would be just being able to host the files out of Google Drive, unless that's technically not possible or if it would make the operation of the app too slow...

Is Github being used for speed considerations or something else?

I did see Dropbox mentioned as backend, so I wonder if any cloud service would do or there are technical limitations to using anything else?

Sorry for all the questions. I did do some quick searches but couldn't find clear enough answers and haven't had the time to delve into this topic.

I've been pretty happy with Roam up until this week, when I found out that the CEO personally banned me from the Roam Reddit community (alongside with many other users) because many months ago I dared to point out some of its shortcomings vis-a-vis some of its competitors.

The pettiness of this, and the fact that the CEO has time to go back and read years' worth of Reddit posts and manually ban members for saying things like it would be important to have automatic daily human readible exports like WorkFlowy or Dynalist has) was that broke this cammel's back.

Here is the back story, it's all really quite ridiculous:

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q0b9fv/mods_are_banning_lots_of_users_from_this/

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q1v1qp/update_to_our_rules_a_note_on_recent_bans_from/

Dr Andus wrote:

>I've been pretty happy with Roam up until this week, when I found out
tha

t the CEO personally banned me from the Roam Reddit community

(alongside with many other users) because many months ago I dared to
point out some of its shortcomings vis-a-vis some of its competitors.

The pettiness of this, and the fact that the CEO has time to go back and
read years' worth of Reddit posts and manually ban members for saying
things like it would be important to have automatic daily human readible
exports like WorkFlowy or Dynalist has) was that broke this cammel's
back.

Here is the back story, it's all really quite ridiculous:

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q0b9fv/mods_are_banning_lots_of_users_from_this/

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q1v1qp/update_to_our_rules_a_note_on_recent_bans_from/

P.S. I might just add for context that I have never been banned from an online forum or from anything else in my life.

I never said anything disrespectful on Roam Reddit. I simply made the point a few times that it would be important to have a daily automatic export of human readible files like Dynalist or WorkFlowy has. Roam does have a daily backup, but it's in a .edn file, which is not human readible (at least for me).

Also, I've been a big fan of Roam, recommending it left and right, but I certainly won't be after this. I never much liked the CEO's attitude and approach to the users but I put up with it because I liked the product.

But now I have completely lost confidence in the longevity of Roam, given the CEO's mercurial approach to customer relations. Some people who were banned have even paid for the $500/5 years Believer Plan (yup, that's what it's called)!

Dr Andus, I am sorry to see what happened to you and others by Roam Research. I looked at the link showing deleted posts.

My gut reaction is that it's possible the banning decision may have more to do with what is happening at RR than the comments on Reddit per se. Unconnected with Reddit, is it possible RR has some internal morale problems related to the the workplace and/or the development of RR? Also, if RR was being courted by a potential investor or buyer, thay could explain the prickly response to what was happening on Reddit.

Another possibility could be Roam's competition, with programs such as Obsidian and Remnote, among others, seeming more prominent than ever.

Would you at this stage consider using Obsidian as a replacement for RR?

Daly

Dr Andus wrote:

Lucas wrote:
>Good idea. Just note that the dev is saying Github support will be
>phased out once Logseq has its own sync service ready.

By "ready" do you mean it's existing already or they are ready to launch
it?

I wouldn't want to invest a lot of time into figuring out how to set up
Github for this, if there are other alternatives.

The ideal solution for me would be just being able to host the files out
of Google Drive, unless that's technically not possible or if it would
make the operation of the app too slow...

Is Github being used for speed considerations or something else?

I did see Dropbox mentioned as backend, so I wonder if any cloud service
would do or there are technical limitations to using anything else?

Sorry for all the questions. I did do some quick searches but couldn't
find clear enough answers and haven't had the time to delve into this
topic.

I've been pretty happy with Roam up until this week, when I found out
that the CEO personally banned me from the Roam Reddit community
(alongside with many other users) because many months ago I dared to
point out some of its shortcomings vis-a-vis some of its competitors.

The pettiness of this, and the fact that the CEO has time to go back and
read years' worth of Reddit posts and manually ban members for saying
things like it would be important to have automatic daily human readible
exports like WorkFlowy or Dynalist has) was that broke this cammel's
back.

Here is the back story, it's all really quite ridiculous:

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q0b9fv/mods_are_banning_lots_of_users_from_this/

https://www.reddit.com/r/RoamResearch/comments/q1v1qp/update_to_our_rules_a_note_on_recent_bans_from/

Daly de Gagne wrote:

Would you at this stage consider using Obsidian as a replacement for RR?

Hi Dale,

yes, it's possible that something else triggered the CEO to do this, but to be honest, he has form in this, he has put off a lot of people in the past with things he said on Twitter or on Reddit (it's a kind of a brusk 'take it or leave it' attitude when customers dare to critcise the product). I just gave him the benefit of the doubt until now.

But as I need a long-term solution (both for my task management, but I also want to move my ConnectedText zettelkasten onto an online platform), and that was my point about bringing up the automatic export issue on Reddit, as that's all about protecting my content, should something happen to the company, I will have to move on from Roam.

I'd love to use Obsidian, it looks amazing, but it doesn't fit my use case, as I can't run Obsidian from a browser, and I also need the block-level transclusion feature that Roam has but Obsidian lacks.

Dr Andus wrote:

I've been pretty happy with Roam up until this week, when I found out
that the CEO personally banned me from the Roam Reddit community
(alongside with many other users) because many months ago I dared to
point out some of its shortcomings vis-a-vis some of its competitors.

The pettiness of this, and the fact that the CEO has time to go back and
read years' worth of Reddit posts and manually ban members for saying
things like it would be important to have automatic daily human readible
exports like WorkFlowy or Dynalist has) was that broke this cammel's
back.

Childish posts and pettiness have been a hallmark of Conor's from the very beginning. When the product was in alpha and he first pushed the hashtag #roamcult on twitter I knew immediately to stay away. He's been this way from the beginning, and has deemed complaints and constructive criticism as 'bullshit'

https://twitter.com/Conaw/status/1445301361994833920

Conor's hubris has reminded me of Steve Jobs's response to his failed attempt to buy Dropbox in 2009; he warned them that Dropbox was a feature, not a product, and they'd soon see stiff competition and profit problems. (Which did transpire; they had to pivot from customer to business, and still for at least the last 5 years they've had negative Net Income.)

Obsidian does have block level transclusion

Dr Andus wrote:

the CEO has time to go back and >read years' worth of Reddit posts and manually ban members

This is pretty damning, especially with the rumours over internal wranglings and disagreements

Dormouse wrote:

Obsidian does have block level transclusion

I wonder if we mean the same thing. I was using Roam terminology for essentially the bullet-point level or individual outline item level (or line level, in plaintext speak). Can Obsidian do transclusion at the line level?

Dr Andus wrote:

Dormouse wrote:
>Obsidian does have block level transclusion

I wonder if we mean the same thing. I was using Roam terminology for
essentially the bullet-point level or individual outline item level (or
line level, in plaintext speak). Can Obsidian do transclusion at the
line level?

Assuming the never-ending markdown text line, then yes.
There needs to be a line of clear space before and after the block.