Gary's note stirred a memory of a great debate that took place 23 years ago about this same issue. It was spurred forth by the great writer and luddite Wendell Berry. This link,

http://home.btconnect.com/tipiglen/berrynot.html

connects to Berry's original brief essay about why he would never buy a computer, some hot-tempered responses from readers, and Berry's subsequent rejoinder. Berry gets the better of the exchange, in my view.

It's definitely worth reading the whole thing, not just because its interesting that this debate is now almost a quarter-centruy old, but also because Berry is one of the most engaging writers around.

Steve

Thanks for link to Berry.

I love his writing, and his sensitivities. I look forward to reading the linked material.

I wonder if he has bought a computer in the meantime.

For poetry, longhand works best for me.

And I enjoy taking longhand notes when talking with someone, or reading books in the library.

But for articles and the like, computer is best (for me, that is).

I love the paraphernalia of long hand - especially fountain pens and Noodlers water-based fountain pen inks which bind with cellulose in paper to become absolutely permanent, water proof, and non-smudgable.

Yesterday I bought my first Pilot disposable fountain pen for under $5 - the whole barrel is full of ink. I am amazed at how well it writes - a very nice nib.

But I digress.

Daly

Stephen Zeoli wrote:

Gary's note stirred a memory of a great debate that took place 23 years ago about this
same issue. It was spurred forth by the great writer and luddite Wendell Berry. This
link,

http://home.btconnect.com/tipiglen/berrynot.html

connects to
Berry's original brief essay about why he would never buy a computer, some
hot-tempered responses from readers, and Berry's subsequent rejoinder. Berry gets
the better of the exchange, in my view.

It's definitely worth reading the whole
thing, not just because its interesting that this debate is now almost a
quarter-centruy old, but also because Berry is one of the most engaging writers
around.

Steve

Many thanks for the link, Steve - very interesting.

Here's one to a recent piece by Michael Bywater: "Everything starts with the pen": http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/features/everything-starts-with-the-pen-2109252.html

I agree with his line: "My own experience, too, is that the words come differently from a pen than from a keyboard." (Relevant to Gary Carson's post on another thread.)

My fountain-pens are amongst my most treasured possessions.

I like fountain pens, too. Smoothest writing instruments ever invented and nothing focuses your attention like writing longhand with a fountain pen.

I've got several fountain pens, but my favorites right now are the Waterman Paris, Namiki Falcon and the Pelikan (can't remember the particular model off the top of my head). The Waterman Paris is pretty cheap (around $40, I think, at Staples) and really smooth after you break in the nib. The others were more expensive ($100+), and really nice, skip-free writers. The Varsity Disposable fountain pens are surprisingly good and ultra-cheap (around $11 on Amazon for a pack of seven). They last forever as well, but you don't have any choice about the nib (they're all fine point, I think). Personally, I like medium nibs.

I really like the minimalism of writing longhand. A pen and a notebook. That's all you need.

Developing a fountain pen obsession is worse than a bad case of CRIMP, let me tell you. Once you develop the obsession, it's all over. The next thing you know, you're getting into all sorts of esoterica like finding the best writing paper, the best pens, the best ink, the best hand-tooled leather pen pouches and blotters and on and on and on. Check out the Fountain Pen Network forum at http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/ for an example of compulsive fountain pen mania.

Just writing about this makes me want to get another pen. It's insanity. One of these days, I'm going to get a Mont Blanc Meisterstuck. They only cost around $800.

Gary, you have my sympathy. I too had a terrible case of fountain pen obsession for several years, and I have a desk full of pens to prove it. Keeping in mind the axiom that the addict is never cured, all I can say is that it is more than two years since I bought a fountain pen. However using my (fine nib) Pelikan still brings a smile to my face (like Daly, using Noodlers).

So, four forum members with a passion for fountain pens. What does that tell us?

JohnK wrote:

So, four forum members with a passion for fountain pens.
What does that tell us?

Make that five. It's been a few years since I've purchased a pen, but I love my collection.

- Wes

Now you can have it all:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/112352920206354603958/posts/J7KU4Nfqjka

Modifying a manual typewriter to work like a computer is an abomination.

This is worse than digital pens or silicone breast implants. It's like installing a lawnmower engine on a 10-speed bicycle or replacing your cat's head with a light bulb.

OK, that last example was a little weird, but the sun's been frying my brain here in the Midwest for a couple of weeks now.

In today's NYT Science Section: "What's Lost as Handwriting Fades"

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/03/science/whats-lost-as-handwriting-fades.html

PDF of the article stored on Dropbox:

https://db.tt/CzP5a4vZ

Lucas wrote:

In today's NYT Science Section: "What's Lost as Handwriting Fades"
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/03/science/whats-lost-as-handwriting-fades.html

Thanks for that, Lucas. It looks like the issue is far from being settled, though.

Whatever the case, I think there might be one thing going in favour of handwriting and typewriters. One definitely has to make a bigger commitment to what is being written down with the former two, than with computers, where it's so easy to delete, alter and rearrange immediately. So there might be a case where the former might compel one to put more thought into what is being written down, which then might turn out to be of higher quality, perhaps less verbose and wasteful, and consequently requiring fewer revisions.

But one could also argue that it's less easy to be experimental and do free writing with the former, which then could lead to writer's block more readily. For this reason I can't even be bothered to test the above theory because I'm afraid that I'd be wasting valuable computer writing time.

There is one more method still: dictation with Dragon NaturallySpeaking. I did try it many times and have always reverted to typing in the end (though with the help of PhraseExpander), as with typing I don't really need to think through the shape of the entire sentence upfront, but Dragon requires one to compose a more or less full sentence in one's head, which I'm finding a lot more taxing activity mentally speaking. Somehow using the hands frees up the mind to think up the next part of the sentence, while dictation requires one to pause to think.

But it's not impossible that these various methods work differently for different people, so it might be down to personal history, makup (physical ability or disability) and preference. But mechanical typewriters may not be that easy to have as an option for much longer...

Dr Andus wrote:

There is one more method still: dictation with Dragon NaturallySpeaking.
I did try it many times and have always reverted to typing in the end
(though with the help of PhraseExpander), as with typing I don't really
need to think through the shape of the entire sentence upfront, but
Dragon requires one to compose a more or less full sentence in one's
head, which I'm finding a lot more taxing activity mentally speaking.
Somehow using the hands frees up the mind to think up the next part of
the sentence, while dictation requires one to pause to think.

I use Dragon Dictate quite a lot for longer pieces of writing - but only having hand-written out, and edited by hand, what I want to say. (My brain can't cope with composing entire sentences that flow, one following another, in my head.) My impression is that my use of it for longer pieces of writing is faster than (my) typing and editing - and I also have sympathy with the "handwriting makes you think better" school (although perhaps that is generational in origin).

I see it as getting two drafts for the price in effort of one-and-a-half. For shorter pieces of writing, the bother of getting out a microphone and launching Dragon doesn't seem to be compensated for me for by the speed of dictation.

The latest version of DD (4.0) is a distinct improvement on its predecessors. The only problem I now have with it is dictating dialogue - too much punctuation, and therefore too much room for error. I usually type those sections - but based again on a hand-written draft.

Dr Andus wrote:

There is one more method still: dictation with Dragon NaturallySpeaking.
I did try it many times and have always reverted to typing in the end
(though with the help of PhraseExpander), as with typing I don't really
need to think through the shape of the entire sentence upfront, but
Dragon requires one to compose a more or less full sentence in one's
head, which I'm finding a lot more taxing activity mentally speaking.
Somehow using the hands frees up the mind to think up the next part of
the sentence, while dictation requires one to pause to think.

That's what I used to think.
When last year I couldn't use my right hand after a dog had bitten me, I gave Dragon Dictate a try - I had urgend deadlines to meet. I found I could mimick my way of writing using DD and my keyboard or mouse: Instead of formulating the entire sentence in my head, I would simply start to dictate half a sentence or so. While waiting for DD to type the words out, I would think about the rest of the sentence. If I noticed that I wanted to make a correction, I would use the mouse or keyboard to jump back and would dictate another 2 or 3 words that should be inserted at the cursor position. So: "patchwork writing" is something you can do with dictation software, too.

Franz Grieser wrote:

Instead of formulating the entire sentence in my head, I would simply
start to dictate half a sentence or so. (...) So: "patchwork writing" is something you can do
with dictation software, too.

Yes, I also tried that. But even with that scenario I found that words come to me more easily at the tip of my fingers than the tip of my tongue. It might be just what one gets used to over a lifetime or the particular gifts one has (sadly I do not have the gift of the gab).

Obviously, it's nice to have the choice, and it's clear that people who don't have that choice (like Steven Hawking) can still go on and produce great works, even by just blinking with one eye!