Outlook add-on for organising emails hierarchically?
Started by Dr Andus
on 7/8/2020
Dr Andus
7/8/2020 5:56 pm
Is there some kind of an add-on for Outlook that allows you to organise emails hierarchicallly, in an outline-like form?
Alternatively, is there some PIM or outliner software where you could just drag and drop Outlook items directly?
I'm on Windows 7 Pro, using Outlook 365 (the full Outlook client).
Previously I used the simplified Outlook web client in conjunction with WorkFlowy and the Clip to Workflowy Chrome extension.
The great thing about the simple Outlook web client was that each email had a specific URL, and so it was easy to organise emails in WorkFlowy and just click on the URL to get back to the given email in Outlook.
However, recently I switched to the fuller web version of Outlook because I like the option to have a dark theme. The downside is that it does not allow using the specific URL for each message any more.
So I'm stuck with either giving up on the idea of the dark theme or no longer being able to have a hierarchical organisation for important emails.
Any other solutions for this? I realise that are PIMs that may have some integration with Outlook. But I'm really just looking for the simplest drag-and-drop functionality of select emails, rather than managing all emails from yet another software (unless there are some really compelling reasons for doing so).
You may ask why do I use both the Windows version of Outlook and the web-version in Chrome? Because I often switch between my Windows laptop and my various Chromebooks, plus because I like to use the dark theme that the web version has, once I my eyeballs can no longer handle the bright white Outlook in Windows.
Thanks in advance.
Alternatively, is there some PIM or outliner software where you could just drag and drop Outlook items directly?
I'm on Windows 7 Pro, using Outlook 365 (the full Outlook client).
Previously I used the simplified Outlook web client in conjunction with WorkFlowy and the Clip to Workflowy Chrome extension.
The great thing about the simple Outlook web client was that each email had a specific URL, and so it was easy to organise emails in WorkFlowy and just click on the URL to get back to the given email in Outlook.
However, recently I switched to the fuller web version of Outlook because I like the option to have a dark theme. The downside is that it does not allow using the specific URL for each message any more.
So I'm stuck with either giving up on the idea of the dark theme or no longer being able to have a hierarchical organisation for important emails.
Any other solutions for this? I realise that are PIMs that may have some integration with Outlook. But I'm really just looking for the simplest drag-and-drop functionality of select emails, rather than managing all emails from yet another software (unless there are some really compelling reasons for doing so).
You may ask why do I use both the Windows version of Outlook and the web-version in Chrome? Because I often switch between my Windows laptop and my various Chromebooks, plus because I like to use the dark theme that the web version has, once I my eyeballs can no longer handle the bright white Outlook in Windows.
Thanks in advance.
Franz Grieser
7/8/2020 8:22 pm
Dottore,
I am not sure I understand your request.
Outlook does not need a separate add-in for managing emails hierarchically: You can create folders (and folders in folders) and drag&drop emails into these folders; you can also create rules to automatically move emails into folders.
When you need an URL for an email: Save the email as .msg. or .html file. You can do that manually or use an add-in for bulk-processing your emails (if you're interested, I can point you to the best add-ins for that).
I am not sure I understand your request.
Outlook does not need a separate add-in for managing emails hierarchically: You can create folders (and folders in folders) and drag&drop emails into these folders; you can also create rules to automatically move emails into folders.
When you need an URL for an email: Save the email as .msg. or .html file. You can do that manually or use an add-in for bulk-processing your emails (if you're interested, I can point you to the best add-ins for that).
Dr Andus
7/8/2020 10:27 pm
Franz Grieser wrote:
Franz,
Thanks for your suggestions.
I think I'm a difficult case, as I don't really like to use Outlook, so ideally I'd prefer to either lift those emails out of Outlook into another software, so I can organise them there, or link to individual Outlook messages from another software, just like I used to do via WorkFlowy to Outlook in Chrome.
I guess I don't like to use the folders in Outlook because it's a bit all too permanent. In WorkFlowy if an email does not turn out to be important, it just gets eventually burried and sedimented over by all the newer WorkFlowy items. But, if I ever need to find that email again, I can find it in its hierarchy or through a search.
I realise I was asking for an add-on or add-in in Outlook, but maybe I was asking for the wrong thing then.
Eventually it's not the email that actually matters but the task or information that it represents or contains. So in WorkFlowy I could just deal with it as a todo or a project item or whatever, and the URL was just there in case I ever needed to look up that email again, to see the rest of the message for context, or if I needed to respond to the people who were copied into the email.
Basically what happened was that my workplace upgraded to Office 365, so suddenly I was able to run the full Windows client on my laptop and to use the nice dark theme on the web client in Chrome, but this has disrupted my existing system that I had with WorkFlowy.
I do need some of the functionality of the full Outlook (previously I just used VMware to dial into the server version, if I ever needed to sort messages via sender or subject etc., which is rather limited in the simplified web version), but now I'm realising that I miss the extra layer of organisation that I had running in WorkFlowy.
I may just need to revert to the super simple web client, so I can have those URL links again...
I am not sure I understand your request.
Franz,
Thanks for your suggestions.
I think I'm a difficult case, as I don't really like to use Outlook, so ideally I'd prefer to either lift those emails out of Outlook into another software, so I can organise them there, or link to individual Outlook messages from another software, just like I used to do via WorkFlowy to Outlook in Chrome.
I guess I don't like to use the folders in Outlook because it's a bit all too permanent. In WorkFlowy if an email does not turn out to be important, it just gets eventually burried and sedimented over by all the newer WorkFlowy items. But, if I ever need to find that email again, I can find it in its hierarchy or through a search.
I realise I was asking for an add-on or add-in in Outlook, but maybe I was asking for the wrong thing then.
Eventually it's not the email that actually matters but the task or information that it represents or contains. So in WorkFlowy I could just deal with it as a todo or a project item or whatever, and the URL was just there in case I ever needed to look up that email again, to see the rest of the message for context, or if I needed to respond to the people who were copied into the email.
Basically what happened was that my workplace upgraded to Office 365, so suddenly I was able to run the full Windows client on my laptop and to use the nice dark theme on the web client in Chrome, but this has disrupted my existing system that I had with WorkFlowy.
I do need some of the functionality of the full Outlook (previously I just used VMware to dial into the server version, if I ever needed to sort messages via sender or subject etc., which is rather limited in the simplified web version), but now I'm realising that I miss the extra layer of organisation that I had running in WorkFlowy.
I may just need to revert to the super simple web client, so I can have those URL links again...
Leib Moscovitz
7/9/2020 4:01 am
There is a PIM that lets you do this - Ultrarecall; you can drag and drop Outlook emails into UR and then organize them hierarchically or however you wish.
There is even a hack which enables you to display Outlook emails internally in UR, and then, again, you can drag them into UR and manipulate them as you see fit.
There is even a hack which enables you to display Outlook emails internally in UR, and then, again, you can drag them into UR and manipulate them as you see fit.
Franz Grieser
7/9/2020 6:39 am
Dr Andus wrote:
Then, the full-blown Outlook client is probably overkill. It's built for handling, managing and archiving massive amounts of emails, for managing contact addresses, calendar items and tasks (though it's not a very powerful todo manager). If you do not use these capabilities, you are probably better off with a simpler tool.
Eventually it's not the email that actually matters but the task or
information that it represents or contains.
Then, the full-blown Outlook client is probably overkill. It's built for handling, managing and archiving massive amounts of emails, for managing contact addresses, calendar items and tasks (though it's not a very powerful todo manager). If you do not use these capabilities, you are probably better off with a simpler tool.
MadaboutDana
7/9/2020 8:27 am
A somewhat lateral approach to e-mail organisation is also possible using MailStore, a powerful e-mail archiving tool for Windows.
It can be used for hierarchical organisation, but what it really excels in is search: it has a very, very powerful search function, so once you’ve archived your e-mails, you can pull up e-mails using Boolean logic in ways most e-mail clients are incapable of.
There’s a free and a Pro version. I thoroughly recommend. We’ve used it to archive our business e-mails for some years, and it’s helped me on a number of critical occasions.
Website at mailstore.com
It can be used for hierarchical organisation, but what it really excels in is search: it has a very, very powerful search function, so once you’ve archived your e-mails, you can pull up e-mails using Boolean logic in ways most e-mail clients are incapable of.
There’s a free and a Pro version. I thoroughly recommend. We’ve used it to archive our business e-mails for some years, and it’s helped me on a number of critical occasions.
Website at mailstore.com
Ken
7/9/2020 7:28 pm
Is there no easy way to obtain the URL in the desktop client of Outlook?
--Ken
--Ken
Franz Grieser
7/9/2020 7:40 pm
Ken wrote:
No, there isn't. All Outlook data is stored inside a PST or OST file (POP resp. IMAP accounts), emails are not stored as separate files (unless you save them as .msg, .html or .txt file).
Is there no easy way to obtain the URL in the desktop client of Outlook?
No, there isn't. All Outlook data is stored inside a PST or OST file (POP resp. IMAP accounts), emails are not stored as separate files (unless you save them as .msg, .html or .txt file).
Ken
7/10/2020 2:51 am
Franz Grieser wrote:
Hi Franz,
Thank you for the response. I know that messages are stored in the PST/OST files, but since they have a unique URL in the O365 web application, I assumed that link was stored with each message, but was perhaps just not visible in the desktop client without a bit of extra effort. It does seem strange to think that a message would have a unique URL, but if Microsoft is hosting, then it might seem to make sense as the URL's seem to be fixed for each message. This is a bit above my pay grade as I am not an IT guy, but I found it interesting to learn that O365 messages do have URLs.
--Ken
Ken wrote:
>Is there no easy way to obtain the URL in the desktop client of
Outlook?
No, there isn't. All Outlook data is stored inside a PST or OST file
(POP resp. IMAP accounts), emails are not stored as separate files
(unless you save them as .msg, .html or .txt file).
Hi Franz,
Thank you for the response. I know that messages are stored in the PST/OST files, but since they have a unique URL in the O365 web application, I assumed that link was stored with each message, but was perhaps just not visible in the desktop client without a bit of extra effort. It does seem strange to think that a message would have a unique URL, but if Microsoft is hosting, then it might seem to make sense as the URL's seem to be fixed for each message. This is a bit above my pay grade as I am not an IT guy, but I found it interesting to learn that O365 messages do have URLs.
--Ken
Cyganet
7/10/2020 8:57 am
Perhaps loading emails into InfoQube will work for you? The document pane will show the email text, and it can handle attachments.
You can choose which emails to load, by setting email polling to manual and marking the emails you want to load as unread on your server. InfoQube doesn't change anything on the server side as far as I know.
Once the emails are in the database, they are regular items, so you can add them to grids and organise them in outlines, add columns and tags to them, link them, query them etc. An InfoQube grid can function like a workflowy outine does.
InfoQube can import the message date & time, sender and recipient, so if you want to find them back on your server you could use that information to search. The import date is also stored (as the item creation date).
You can choose which emails to load, by setting email polling to manual and marking the emails you want to load as unread on your server. InfoQube doesn't change anything on the server side as far as I know.
Once the emails are in the database, they are regular items, so you can add them to grids and organise them in outlines, add columns and tags to them, link them, query them etc. An InfoQube grid can function like a workflowy outine does.
InfoQube can import the message date & time, sender and recipient, so if you want to find them back on your server you could use that information to search. The import date is also stored (as the item creation date).
Franz Grieser
7/10/2020 10:22 am
Ken wrote:
Till 2017, I wrote a newsletter covering Outlook. One of our readers asked how he could find out the URL of an email. As I couldn't answer his question, I asked a developer who wrote Outlook add-ins at that time - his answer was that there was no way he could get that info from the PST/OST files.
That was 3 years ago, I do not know if that has changed in the meantime. But I doubt as the PST files from the current Outlook 365 can be still opened in Outlook 2016 - so I guess the PST file structure has not changed.
Just my 2 cents as a non-programmer.
Franz
Thank you for the response. I know that messages are stored in the
PST/OST files, but since they have a unique URL in the O365 web
application, I assumed that link was stored with each message, but was
perhaps just not visible in the desktop client without a bit of extra
effort. It does seem strange to think that a message would have a
unique URL, but if Microsoft is hosting, then it might seem to make
sense as the URL's seem to be fixed for each message. This is a bit
above my pay grade as I am not an IT guy, but I found it interesting to
learn that O365 messages do have URLs.
Till 2017, I wrote a newsletter covering Outlook. One of our readers asked how he could find out the URL of an email. As I couldn't answer his question, I asked a developer who wrote Outlook add-ins at that time - his answer was that there was no way he could get that info from the PST/OST files.
That was 3 years ago, I do not know if that has changed in the meantime. But I doubt as the PST files from the current Outlook 365 can be still opened in Outlook 2016 - so I guess the PST file structure has not changed.
Just my 2 cents as a non-programmer.
Franz
Ken
7/10/2020 4:15 pm
Franz Grieser wrote:
Interesting, and a bit of a small mystery. I usually count on you as one of my Outlook gurus, so if this has you stumped, it may take a bit more sleuthing to better understand. It probably has some simple answer, but then again we are digging under the hood, and anything is possible.
Thanks,
--Ken
Ken wrote:
>Thank you for the response. I know that messages are stored in the
>PST/OST files, but since they have a unique URL in the O365 web
>application, I assumed that link was stored with each message, but was
>perhaps just not visible in the desktop client without a bit of extra
>effort. It does seem strange to think that a message would have a
>unique URL, but if Microsoft is hosting, then it might seem to make
>sense as the URL's seem to be fixed for each message. This is a bit
>above my pay grade as I am not an IT guy, but I found it interesting to
>learn that O365 messages do have URLs.
Till 2017, I wrote a newsletter covering Outlook. One of our readers
asked how he could find out the URL of an email. As I couldn't answer
his question, I asked a developer who wrote Outlook add-ins at that time
- his answer was that there was no way he could get that info from the
PST/OST files.
That was 3 years ago, I do not know if that has changed in the meantime.
But I doubt as the PST files from the current Outlook 365 can be still
opened in Outlook 2016 - so I guess the PST file structure has not
changed.
Just my 2 cents as a non-programmer.
Franz
Interesting, and a bit of a small mystery. I usually count on you as one of my Outlook gurus, so if this has you stumped, it may take a bit more sleuthing to better understand. It probably has some simple answer, but then again we are digging under the hood, and anything is possible.
Thanks,
--Ken
Franz Grieser
7/10/2020 5:06 pm
Ken wrote:
Thanks for the guru.
But maybe that's what they call the twilight of gurus ;-)
Interesting, and a bit of a small mystery. I usually count on you as
one of my Outlook gurus, so if this has you stumped, it may take a bit
more sleuthing to better understand.
Thanks for the guru.
But maybe that's what they call the twilight of gurus ;-)
Arnold
7/10/2020 8:45 pm
Zoot software maybe able to help, there is a free trial to test your needs.
https://www.zootsoftware.com/#/outlook/
I do not have an Outlook cloud account so unable to test
https://www.zootsoftware.com/#/outlook/
I do not have an Outlook cloud account so unable to test
Dr Andus
7/13/2020 12:47 pm
Thank you all for the suggestions.
For now I'm experimenting with Ultra Recall for this, which I've never managed to find a use for before (ConnectedText fulfilled most of my needs).
But it works exactly as what I was looking for: drag and drop an Outlook message item into a tree hierarchy, and be able to organise it further within that hierarchy.
I was also considering reverting to the Light Web Outlook version, but Microsoft has successfully hidden it from me somehow.
I've deleted all my cookies etc., still I am unable to find my way back into it.
I wouldn't be surprised if MS was trying to deliberately wean users from it. Sadly the Light version was the only one with individualised URLs for each message. Oh, well...
@Leib
It doesn't look like I need a hack (unless I'm misunderstanding what you meant). UR seems to display the Outlook message automatically.
Thanks for the tip in any case.
Leib Moscovitz wrote:
For now I'm experimenting with Ultra Recall for this, which I've never managed to find a use for before (ConnectedText fulfilled most of my needs).
But it works exactly as what I was looking for: drag and drop an Outlook message item into a tree hierarchy, and be able to organise it further within that hierarchy.
I was also considering reverting to the Light Web Outlook version, but Microsoft has successfully hidden it from me somehow.
I've deleted all my cookies etc., still I am unable to find my way back into it.
I wouldn't be surprised if MS was trying to deliberately wean users from it. Sadly the Light version was the only one with individualised URLs for each message. Oh, well...
@Leib
It doesn't look like I need a hack (unless I'm misunderstanding what you meant). UR seems to display the Outlook message automatically.
Thanks for the tip in any case.
Leib Moscovitz wrote:
There is a PIM that lets you do this - Ultrarecall; you can drag and
drop Outlook emails into UR and then organize them hierarchically or
however you wish.
There is even a hack which enables you to display Outlook emails
internally in UR, and then, again, you can drag them into UR and
manipulate them as you see fit.
Leib Moscovitz
7/13/2020 2:28 pm
Glad to hear that UR seems to be doing the job for you!
The hack to which I was referring lets you view your Outlook inbox (etc.) WITHIN UR - see e.g. https://kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=1632&highlight=ldangelo and the Outlook Viewer Items in the Outlook.URD files which are installed when you install UR.
If you are interested in doing this, but you are using UR 6.0 and it doesn't work, you can PM me for a hack which lets you do this (I recently notified UR support about this hack as well.)
Good luck!
The hack to which I was referring lets you view your Outlook inbox (etc.) WITHIN UR - see e.g. https://kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=1632&highlight=ldangelo and the Outlook Viewer Items in the Outlook.URD files which are installed when you install UR.
If you are interested in doing this, but you are using UR 6.0 and it doesn't work, you can PM me for a hack which lets you do this (I recently notified UR support about this hack as well.)
Good luck!
Dr Andus
7/13/2020 10:31 pm
Leib Moscovitz wrote:
I see... Thanks for explaining this.Very kind of you. Actually I'm still on version 4... And it turns out that what's described at that link was already working automatically with Outlook 365!
I was actually a bit shocked to see that UR was already fully synced with my Outlook account without me having to set up anything. On top of that it all happened in the sample introduction file...
But actually I wasn't planning to use this functionality yet (perhaps once I begin to understand why I would want it). At the moment I'm content with dragging and dropping individual emails into folders I've created.
I like the fact that I can organise the interface to my liking and that I can add notes to individual emails.
So far so good. Finally I found a use for this software I bought probably some 10 years ago...
The hack to which I was referring lets you view your Outlook inbox
(etc.) WITHIN UR - see e.g.
https://kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=1632&highlight=ldangelo and
the Outlook Viewer Items in the Outlook.URD files which are installed
when you install UR.
I see... Thanks for explaining this.Very kind of you. Actually I'm still on version 4... And it turns out that what's described at that link was already working automatically with Outlook 365!
I was actually a bit shocked to see that UR was already fully synced with my Outlook account without me having to set up anything. On top of that it all happened in the sample introduction file...
But actually I wasn't planning to use this functionality yet (perhaps once I begin to understand why I would want it). At the moment I'm content with dragging and dropping individual emails into folders I've created.
I like the fact that I can organise the interface to my liking and that I can add notes to individual emails.
So far so good. Finally I found a use for this software I bought probably some 10 years ago...
Ken
7/16/2020 4:32 am
This may not exactly address your problem, but I just saw that Microsoft is releasing a new Outlook product in O365 (now M365?) that is currently called Project Moca. There are several articles about it if you do a web search. Not sure what to make of it, but it could be interesting. It does allow you to pull email messages and save them in the work space with other types of information.
--Ken
--Ken