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EN 3 Changes and a Market Overview
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Posted by dan7000
May 7, 2008 at 07:31 PM
re EN 3.0
I’ve been using the 3.0 beta a lot lately, really trying to give it a fair shake. I am actually quite optimistic about the concept but I don’t think it’s executed well enough yet, in 3 respects: web integration, clipping, rich formatting, and data storage.
Web Integration:
I really like this idea. Daly, you say that some people don’t like the idea of storing data on the web. But that’s not really what EN3 does. It stores data on the web and the desktop, and allows syncing between them. Or you can store only on the desktop and turn sync off.
I like the idea because I use multiple machines and I want my notes everywhere, and this looks like a painless way to do it.
Also, I like it because I’m a CRIMPer and this is a shiny new idea that nobody else is trying :)
Clipping:
Daly mentions that EN2.2 was one of the best web clippers available. I never used it except for a brief trial, so I don’t know about 2.2, but 3.0 is terrible. Formatting from clipped pages is totally destroyed in 3.0. Moreover, this is true for all types of copied and pasted data - not just from the web. For instance, if I copy from a Word doc and paste into 3.0, the formatting from the Word doc is likely to be messed up. Same thing with using the send to EN button in Outlook.
Rich Note Formatting:
This area is obviously related to the richness of clipping, and thus it is also terrible. No support for tables in a note. Need I say more?
Data Storage:
By “data storage” I mean types of data you can keep in the program. In ADM and OneNote I can drag an entire file into the program and it’s stored there. Or I can paste a picture into a note, or insert a picture file. Some other programs have full OLE/ActiveX support, so you can paste many types of rich data into a document and edit in-place. For instance, I can insert an Excel table into Word and then edit the excel table in-place in the word document using Excel’s own editing code. (Why can’t OneNote do that?)
EN allows me to paste a very limited set of non-text data into a note, and does not allow me to store a whole file in a note. You can’t even insert common picture file types.
This feature is the deal-killer for me. The thing that would make EN’s web/desktop integration really cool and worthwhile would be if I could use it as a platform for all of my work. But it doesn’t help me to have my notes about a particular document on 2 machines, if the document itself is only available on 1 machine.
Posted by Daly de Gagne
May 8, 2008 at 01:30 AM
Your note pormpted me to get off my backside and try the ne EN3.
So far, with a minimum of testing, I am impressed.
I thought it did a reasonable job with the complex page referred to in a more recent topic here comparing 100 plus GTD applications.
EN 2.2 did a better job, but I think both did well considering all the data in the page. I am not against the notion of storing on the web, as long as I can synch with my computer=based file, and apparently that is doable.
I am going to import one of my smaller EN2.2 files and see how that goes.
Daly
dan7000 wrote:
>re EN 3.0
>
>I’ve been using the 3.0 beta a lot lately, really trying to give it a fair
>shake. I am actually quite optimistic about the concept but I don’t think it’s
>executed well enough yet, in 3 respects: web integration, clipping, rich
>formatting, and data storage.
>
>Web Integration:
>I really like this idea. Daly, you
>say that some people don’t like the idea of storing data on the web. But that’s not
>really what EN3 does. It stores data on the web and the desktop, and allows syncing
>between them. Or you can store only on the desktop and turn sync off.
>I like the idea
>because I use multiple machines and I want my notes everywhere, and this looks like a
>painless way to do it.
>Also, I like it because I’m a CRIMPer and this is a shiny new idea
>that nobody else is trying :)
>
>Clipping:
>Daly mentions that EN2.2 was one of the best
>web clippers available. I never used it except for a brief trial, so I don’t know about
>2.2, but 3.0 is terrible. Formatting from clipped pages is totally destroyed in 3.0.
>Moreover, this is true for all types of copied and pasted data - not just from the web.
>For instance, if I copy from a Word doc and paste into 3.0, the formatting from the Word
>doc is likely to be messed up. Same thing with using the send to EN button in Outlook.
>
>
>Rich Note Formatting:
>This area is obviously related to the richness of clipping,
>and thus it is also terrible. No support for tables in a note. Need I say more?
>
>Data
>Storage:
>By “data storage” I mean types of data you can keep in the program. In ADM and
>OneNote I can drag an entire file into the program and it’s stored there. Or I can paste a
>picture into a note, or insert a picture file. Some other programs have full
>OLE/ActiveX support, so you can paste many types of rich data into a document and edit
>in-place. For instance, I can insert an Excel table into Word and then edit the excel
>table in-place in the word document using Excel’s own editing code. (Why can’t
>OneNote do that?)
>EN allows me to paste a very limited set of non-text data into a note,
>and does not allow me to store a whole file in a note. You can’t even insert common
>picture file types.
>This feature is the deal-killer for me. The thing that would make
>EN’s web/desktop integration really cool and worthwhile would be if I could use it as a
>platform for all of my work. But it doesn’t help me to have my notes about a particular
>document on 2 machines, if the document itself is only available on 1 machine.
>
Posted by Daly de Gagne
May 8, 2008 at 01:46 AM
EN3 update: I just imported all of my EN2.2 notes into EN3.
As far as I can see, it went perfectly.
I have not discovered how to get a list view yet on EN3, but am sure there must be one—or if there isn’t one now, there will be later, because EN has indicated some 2.2 features may not show up right away.
I think the EN developers have been very clever in seeing how the product can be used in different ways.
For example, I can email a clip to my EN web file if I am on someone else’s computer, and then synch it to my computer based EN file after.At a time when a lot of web2 apps were starting to look the same, EN3 may be a welcome change.
Daly
Posted by dan7000
May 8, 2008 at 04:28 PM
Daly de Gagne wrote:
...>For example, I can
>email a clip to my EN web file if I am on someone else’s computer, and then synch it to my
>computer based EN file after.At a time when a lot of web2 apps were starting to look the
>same, EN3 may be a welcome change.
>
Yeah - that’s one of the things that’s so cool about the whole concept. It really can be an ever-present note manager. I use two computers all day, and I’ve started using EN3 as a kind of clipboard between them.
Posted by Captain CowPie
May 20, 2008 at 01:01 PM
I’ve been doing the same thing between my Mac and PCs. It’s an easy way to get things between the computers quickly. There are a lot of things I would like to see, but I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they will show up.
Vince
dan7000 wrote:
>
>
>Yeah - that’s one of the things that’s so cool about the whole concept. It
>really can be an ever-present note manager. I use two computers all day, and I’ve
>started using EN3 as a kind of clipboard between them.