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Top Developments in 2007
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Posted by Graham Rhind
Dec 27, 2007 at 10:52 AM
You missed my posts, then, in that thread - Ultra Recall continues to crash for me with great regularity on any PC I try it on. It does not lose data because it is built on a database that doesn’t roll back. However, having to restart the program after every other transaction within it is a real pain and limits its usefulness to me. It’s clearly related to the way it is used - I have heard this complaint from all sides, as often as I hear people like you and Jan mention that they have had no problems.
Graham
Alexander Deliyannis wrote:
>I would note that I specifically started a thread
>here at some point to see whether there were any real issues (e.g. data loss, stability
>etc) encountered with UltraRecall and there were none.
Posted by Jan Rifkinson
Dec 27, 2007 at 02:09 PM
Graham Rhind wrote:
>[snip] Ultra Recall continues to crash for me with
>great regularity on any PC I try it on. It does not lose data because it is built on a
>database that doesn’t roll back. However, having to restart the program after every
>other transaction within it is a real pain and limits its usefulness to me. It’s
>clearly related to the way it is used [/snip]
Graham,
From what you describe certainly limits UR’s usefulness (an understatement) but your post begs a few questions:
(1) How do / did you use UR?
(2) Where are these people reporting these program crashes when you hear from just as many people reporting constant crashes? One would think these would appear on the UR forum & I haven’t seen that kind of report recently.
(3) what kind of system are you on?
(4) did you try to repair / compact the data base or can you identify situations in which these crashes were inevitable?
None of these are meant as challenges to your credibility, rather a curiosity on my part.
Posted by Graham Rhind
Dec 27, 2007 at 02:43 PM
Happy to respond, Jan. Please see my responses interleaved below.
Jan Rifkinson wrote:
>
>Graham Rhind wrote:
>>[snip] Ultra Recall continues to crash for me with
>>great
>regularity on any PC I try it on. It does not lose data because it is built on a
>>database
>that doesn’t roll back. However, having to restart the program after every
>>other
>transaction within it is a real pain and limits its usefulness to me. It’s
>>clearly
>related to the way it is used [/snip]
>
>Graham,
>
>From what you describe certainly
>limits UR’s usefulness (an understatement) but your post begs a few questions:
>
>(1)
>How do / did you use UR?
At the moment only for structured customer and process data. I.e., I make new templates for customer data and processing statistics and data entry into them.
>(2) Where are these people reporting these program crashes
>when you hear from just as many people reporting constant crashes? One would think
>these would appear on the UR forum & I haven’t seen that kind of report recently.
I don’t check the UR forum any more, and I would assume that anybody using UR and experiencing crashes would not proceed with using the program and wouldn’t report it anyway. UR is one of those programs which creates fierce loyalty in its users, and few people enjoy being barked at if they don’t enjoy the same stability as others. Anyway, I’ve seen reports in this forum and in other online forums, but I couldn’t, to be honest, name any offhand. If I hadn’t seen them I would have continued to assume that the problems were mine only, which I don’t.
>(3)
>what kind of system are you on?
Windows XP. I used to use UR on an XP system where I was not completely happy with the memory and setup, and I assumed that the crashes were system-dependent. However, I have moved UR to a high-spec system with the maximum allowable memory for an XP machine. UR crashes slightly less often, but it crashes. It exits without any message from UR or from Windows, so it seems that neither is “aware” of the crash. Having disposed of the memory problem theory I have two remaining theories on why I am having problems:
1) UR clashes with another program. There are some programs that I use on all my systems, so if UR doesn’t like one of them, it won’t work on any system. However, no other program crashes on my systems as UR does.
2) I’m tending towards UR not being able to manage the speed with which I work. The underlying database clearly takes a while to close and save one record and to move on to the next. I note that the faster I work, the more UR crashes. If I use my mouse at a snail’s pace, UR stays up longer.
>(4) did you try to repair / compact the data base or can
>you identify situations in which these crashes were inevitable?
No to the first question - I’ve never considered the possibility that the database had become corrupted - as a database manager I can usually recognise the symptons and would have responded. Also, UR has been like this for me since day 1. However, I’ll try it…
I’ve tried it. Darn it, it won’t crash at will any more - sod’s law? I’ll keep the group updated ....
Graham
Posted by Ken Ashworth
Dec 27, 2007 at 03:45 PM
Graham Rhind wrote:
>2) I’m
>tending towards UR not being able to manage the speed with which I work. The underlying
>database clearly takes a while to close and save one record and to move on to the next. I
>note that the faster I work, the more UR crashes. If I use my mouse at a snail’s pace, UR
>stays up longer.
Yes, this would seem to describe some of the crashes I’ve experienced during the year (since the release of v.3x), although I’m no speed demon on the keyboard. What I’ve experienced seems more connected to Form Refreshes or writing to the record after moving focus off the Form.
All very intermittent with no discernable pattern. ‘Course, if the frequency of these interruptions were to increase to the levels you describe - I’d think twice about continued use also.
These situations would “lose” the data from the last entry, which is understandable since the program is not completing the write operation. In most cases it required a forced shutdown of UR.
I will say that these instances have been more infrequent of late, so it may have some connection to the current release addressing some of these problems.
Posted by Jan Rifkinson
Dec 27, 2007 at 06:13 PM
Graham, Thanks so much for taking the time to respond to my queries. I’m truly puzzled because what you describe is just so foreign to my experience. Here’s what I know / think about the particular situation you reference.
I cannot explain why URp crashes on all your machines. Of course it is possible that it is in conflict w something else but one would assume @ this stage that this behavior is more Win95-98 like vs w2k or XP.
All things are *not* perfect in my URp world either as there have been irregularities but no data loss & very, very few program crashes for the past months. In fact, I can’t remember the last one.
OTOH I do see issues, principally one & not an inconsequential one either.
As you know URp saves items to DB either when focus changes or user uses
S (which I do quite often out of habit).
However, if I enter data & quickly jump to another tab that may have an automated function like search, this can cause a non-lethal AV, i.e. the program doesn’t crash but all the remaining views can get screwed up, referencing the wrong items in the related item panes or simply not refreshing properly.
I also find this may occur if I leave URp open overnight (clock / reminder change).
As a result, the user has to be careful when one of the AVs occur to refresh or close / re-open the remaining tabbed views. etc.
Kinook has addressed this issue & seems to be gaining on it bit by bit as the latest version (3.2.6) is a whole lot better that the earlier v3s. However, it is not bomb proof & it is very hard to track as it seems to happen irregularly (as you just discovered :)
I’m convinced (however as a non-techie) that URp has a problem ordering functions when the situation I described occurs, i.e. one incomplete function running head-on to another function.
This I have seen described by a number of people in a number of ways so I’m encouraged that this is the locus of the problem but what, if anything, can be done about it is beyond my pay grade. However, I’m sure Kinook is committed to nail it down as they appear very prompt & meticulous in their approach to problems as they pop up.
I don’t know if any of this will help you or anyone else but this has been my experience & when you (& others) refer to working speedily, I think this is what is meant…. or at least, it is how I translate it.
Happy New Year to you all.