Bitsdujour lists Myinfo as an upcoming deal. I use AskSam (since 2005) primarily for capturing web text (pictures are generally secondary to me) for research work for clients (travel). Blogs and the like for review later and reference. There's other database stuff I do also that fields come in handy for.

Anyone who knows both of the PIM's have any suggestions for me to focus on during my quick trial of MyInfo?

Thanks in advance.
Steve

Sorry, this would be too late for your buying decision.

But...

1)

In your case, comparison of rendering web pages in both applics would seem to be the main criterion? And as far as I know, whilst MI is not perfect in this respect, AS is rather bad, so you would probably get "something better" anyway, from your possible switch. This might not necessarily apply to then searching those "clips", but in your case, a switch from AS to Surfulater would have been preferable anyway? Too late for this year, was on bits about two months ago. But why not trial both Surfulator, and then WebResearch, which is 40$ all year round, whilst Surfulater is 2 times that price, without being necessarily better - there are some interesting comparative reviews of both in the web.

2)

MI is a rather good "all-round" outliner, but transition from 5 to 6 at least was a nightmare, most new functionality of minor 5 developments were lost for version 5 users (= just "beta" ones, with automatic cease of functioning then), so you had to buy version 6 in order to get them permanently (which means buying 5 just got you a very early 5, without even minor updates, and that version was bug-ridden and unstable, I several times lost data with it, so it was unusable in the end), and in 6 (if you then paid for 6), some functionality of 5 wasn't there anymore.

Now, they prepare version 7 (no free update for 6 buyers, of course), and that will have a "new file format", i.e. they will change their proprietary db to another one. Now from my experience with 5 and 6 (and the intro of many new bugs whenever they exterminated old ones), transition from 6 to 7, next year, well, what should I say... Let me put it this way: Perhaps version 7 becomes really interesting in some 2 years or so, but people switching to MI now and intending to then switch to 7 as soon as possible will possibly be in for a treat... or call it "adventure".

Don't be fooled by its frequent minor updates: They are quite minor and more often then not serve to eliminate freshly introduced new bugs. Conceptually-wise, 6 is not that much more elaborate than v5 4 years ago, and with all the new probs for the 7 file format to be resolved, don't expect too much new things from 7 either.

Lots of good, half-baken ideas, ok, but then let them remain that way for years and years and years, instead of developing them - life's too short for waiting forever. (Just one example, filtering of tags - if I'm not totally mistaken, quick item filtering by a combination of tags (or by successively narrowing down) is as impossible as it had been 5 years ago; and yes, such combinations are possible by searching, but that's another subject.)

Sorry for being late one day but I didn't want to harm their business these last two days. ;-)

My experience with MyInfo has been quite different. I've used it for many years and have always found it extremely stable. I don't think I've ever lost any data in it. It's true that there are often minor bugs in the new releases, but that seems to be true of all software, and Petko is conscientious about fixing them very quickly.

Right now I'm working on two books -- one in MyInfo and one in Evernote. That's been an interesting experience. It has reminded me that I feel great fondness for MyInfo. There are just two features of Evernote that I miss badly in it: a synchronized mobile version, and EN's ability to OCR text in images.

Bill

Try myBase (plus plugin WebCollect). It saves Web pages quickly. You can even do some editing of the saved Web pages, although it can be a bit of a pain. I've used various versions for years. Previous versions have been very stable, but I haven't yet used the latest version enough to vouch for it. Search this forum for my previous comments on myBase.

"My experience with MyInfo has been quite different. I’ve used it for many years and have always found it extremely stable. I don’t think I’ve ever lost any data in it. It’s true that there are often minor bugs in the new releases, but that seems to be true of all software, and Petko is conscientious about fixing them very quickly."

Extremely stable, oh no (UR is extremely stable, e.g.). But I'm speaking of real use with early v5 flavours here, and their instability was the reason I then got the idea to cut up my trees into rather tiny ones, so I have to thankful for that.

"Petko is conscientious about fixing them very quickly" - yes and no. "Fixing" issues for a paid version by doing betas running out of time, then consolidating them into a new paid version only if you need those "fixes" permanently leaves users not willing to update with something quite doubtful, to put it VERY politely.

Well, the only reasonable conclusion is that we had completely different experiences. I have been an extremely heavy user of MyInfo for a number of years, and I did not encounter most of the problems you describe.

My impression of Petko is that he is very slow and cautious. I certainly don't think he is being unfair to his customers, as you seem to imply. He just seems to proceed at a deliberate pace. I was aware of that, and I took it into account when I began using his program. On the other hand, I've always found him unusually reliable and helpful.

It's fair enough to say that MyInfo didn't meet your needs, but I don't understand why you would choose to attack the motives or character of a developer.

Bill

Bill, Professor,

You're wrong here,

"My impression of Petko is that he is very slow and cautious."

Right, and I certainly don't want to give the impression MI's bad, the opposite is true, in our current context.

"I certainly don’t think he is being unfair to his customers, as you seem to imply."

Wrong, I just, by some sort of "lightness of my heart", continue to mention things that are both true and should not have been done the way they were done; I could also have mentioned that in the help file of MI - which made me decide to BUY MI, and third-parties must know that the MI trial is crippled, and does not let you trial those functions; you must will know about it when you buy, not in the trial period - pretended much more export functionality than the prof. version really had, and has - and the developer then said he would introduce this missing functionality soon, and now, 3 years later, nothing has been done with that. If I imply something, it's just a "Mediterranian stance", nothing more; I'm not calling him a liar, neither a crook or something, it's just that I state FACTS here, and would have proceeded in a quite different way, and again, very early v5 versions were then "updated" into JUST BETAS coming to an end soon, instead of them being the usual "minor upgrades" we all expect to be included within the price of the paid "major version". THESE ARE FACTS, and I could PROVE them anytime, including the missing export features which could not be trialled before buying.

"He just seems to proceed at a deliberate pace. I was aware of that, and I took it into account when I began using his program. On the other hand, I’ve always found him unusually reliable and helpful." - In spite of the provable facts above, I consider "Petko" a reliable and honest man, but let's face it, in the past, with any update eliminating notified bugs, there were lots of new bugs, and this seems to indicate his "sw engineering" is quite bad - mine was terrible, 15 years ago, but I would certainly not replicate such a chaos anymore.

"It’s fair enough to say that MyInfo didn’t meet your needs, but I don’t understand why you would choose to attack the motives or character of a developer." - As said, I can PROVE what I say (and this also concerns the lost data, respectively the horrible notifications I got in those instances.

Professor, let me make this very clear, I'm an expert in these things, and I don't allow anybody to imply I'm a liar (except for a little bit "cheating" when I got to this forum this third time - and this time I would need to be THROWN out to leave, but then, I don't have the slightest intention to trigger such a move from its owner). I consider MI as one of the "current leaders of the pack", since I am not able, currently, to offer you something better, and since most other competitors ain't in that "second range" (which could get another entry as soon as that South African sw gets clones; Zoot, IQ, TB, CT, TP Business/Enterprise, IS and WhF being all "first-class", a really ace application missing).

As we all know, whenever a certain 1-pane outliner is mentioned, Cassius intervenes and says, he lost data with it; this can be retrieved 6 or perhaps 8 times now. Instead of criticising Cassius for this, I took his stance as my model, if you want: In fact, in both cases, the respective developer never amended our respective (and provable) point of interest: MI did never some "minor updating within v5" but forces you to pay for 6 or to live with shaggy early-5 (not mentioning its wrong export claims), and Cassius' 1-pane outliner never got beyond the state where anybody could lose data anytime, for the same reason Cassius correctly states.

So we both are right in reminding those points, since our respective "contracting party" (note I'm not speaking of "adversary" or such here) did not fulfill their respective duty (since our respective points were notified to them in due time, years ago, before our addressing the "public" with our respective "cause").

Did it ever occur to you, Professor, that in both cases, we'd be perfectly happy that the respective developers just followed our "public advice"? And yes, there should be a version 2.a of Cassius' 1-pane outliner, not for further developing, but which finally would have left out the major bugs, and yes, there should have been an MI 5.9 version, i.e. the latest "5 beta", ___for paying 5 customers___, and without the bugs of early 5 versions, as in their latest "5 beta" then.

I'm perfectly aware that there are people of different kind, those that "dont' forget and want things being straigthened out", and those like you, Professor, who say, "let's look forward (only)" - both stances are perfectly reasonable, but advocates of both have to accept that the other stance is legitimate, too.

Or put it in other words, we "why you always didn't fulfill this obligation" advocates may become a little bit "vieux jeu", with those years passing, but that doesn't make our stance wrong. And as InfoSelect proves, you could perfectly give a 5.9 to any buyer of 5, instead of forcing him to live with buggy 5.1 or such, and yes, the owner of NoteMap has plenty of money to get rid of the bugs in v.2, even though he's not interested in developing it any further.

Professor, let's remain perfectly constructive. I'd like to have left the perfect outliner to this world when I'll die, and Mr. "Petko" is not the kind of people who's striving for such a claim, which does not make him "unfair" or such, it's just that some people, to which I belong, are quite overscrupulous, and makes them "different" from the "in some cases, 2+2 should be considered 5" kind, and I know this produces so-called "stress" "on both sides", but then, we all know, the IM dilemma has never been solved - that's why we're crimping.

Please, Professor, try to argument whenever you think I'm (partially or entirely) wrong, I promise no honest argument (bad or on-the-spot) will ever be lost in my search for outliner-perfect.

I'm aware that sometimes I'm a little bit "snappy" when 50 or 80 lines of serious development are meant to be buries by a simple "well, that's old" or "well, that might not be true", but then, that's not constructive; I'd never contradict an argument that makes me think again... but then, in discussion, it's OUR duty to make think the participant whom we deem wrong.

"Petko", ever, has chosen the "easy way" for any real problem (just one example, what I told him about the necessary "super tree", and then his poor "workspace solution", even crappy ActionOutline has got that), and that will not make him a "solutioner" for any real problem, but don't take me wrong:

I repeat what I always said: His "deep-linking" into paragraphs is outstanding and unparalleld.

Just don't get into meta communication simili-facts when people relate facts; hiding the latter will not advance our common cause.

"Barney", on DC, 3 days ago: "For the first query, I've tried MyBase, EssentialPIM, amongst others. Don't remember all of 'em anymore. None were really bad, just not good enough huh."

That says it all. Again, before I die, I would like to offer something better than I devised 15 years ago, and something better than those coders give us today. And I would need any help in thinking about this anybody here could contribute, and then it'll be a pleasure for me to spend some 50.000 $ or more on any coding task I'm unable to deliver myself in the creation of such ace sw.

I'm sure the others here are bored by this disagreement between us. Let's just conclude by saying that we see MyInfo differently.

Bill (no longer a professor, incidentally)

http://funnyexam.com/answers/popular/1649-the-date-is-4-20-thumbs

(Note the date)

;-)

Thanks to all for your replies. To test MyInfo as the replacement for AskSam; I scanned the help file for anything to seemed immediately important, Used MyInfo in all cases where I normally would have used AskSam. I found enough that I liked about it to purchase the Standard license.

I'm not interested in whether the captured web pages rendered exactly, it's the text I want in a readable format. AskSam can do that, but MyInfo does that better. AskSam does offer a capture method that suits my business work for clients best though - I don't have to have it running, I can choose with database to send the captured data to on the fly, and I can add Keywords plus comments right at the capture point. So, at this time my plan is to keep using AskSam for that business work but everything else goes to MyInfo.

As for having problems or not with MyInfo that have been shared, I'll keep my eyes open for problems.

Thanks again.
Steve

"AskSam does offer a capture method that suits my business work for clients best though - I don’t have to have it running, I can choose with database to send the captured data to on the fly, and I can add Keywords plus comments right at the capture point. So, at this time my plan is to keep using AskSam for that business work"

Thank YOU, Steve, the (defunct) AS forum had been so full of webpage rendering problems that I did never try this as much as I should have, and so what you say here about AS is new me and very instructive for me.

Of course, as Stephen rightly say, the current situation of AS is quite desastrous, so somebody who would have to buy AS to begin with would perhaps had chosen something else instead.

I would also like to remind readers not familiar with MI and/or UR that for having "just the text, searchable, within and from the outliner, the original source being in its original format", UR is rather good, and TB is, too, but your choice is even more evidence to what I claim, that immediate accessibility of such a program to a prospect is really important if you, as a developer, want your program to be bought. (And yes, between 5 and 6, MI became much better.)