Outliners and the file system, again (and a hint to get the max out of TB free edition)

< Next Topic | Back to topic list | Previous Topic >

Posted by 22111
Nov 23, 2013 at 06:09 PM

I just discovered an old thread, with a new post, in the Milenix (MyInfo) forum:

http://forums.milenix.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3640

where people ask for “Multiple Attachments per Document” (meaning item within the tree), and where again MyBase is mentioned regarding this unique (?) feature.

As I have said before, the problem with this lies within the (currently) missing synching functionality of such outliner subsets of your file M documents; either outliner developers do their homework at last, and introduce synching of special sub-folders of the file system, or you, as a user, you would be better advised to reconsider your outliner use, i.e. relegate your outliner files to the status of any other files in your system (technically speaking, at least), and work from your file system, again, as you did in the ancient days.

Both alternatives would imply “virtual folders” within your file system, i.e., why not, regular folders but in which there are some original files, but links to files, too - the “original” being stored “systematically”, i.e. by taxonomy, whilst the “extra” folder would be by project.

You can also include such a system into your outliner, by FINALLY REFRAINING from linking to files, but by systematically LINKING TO FOLDERS. In the end, your additions, your add-ons, will be processed by your file system, and within your file system, and even if you do it from within your outliner (much more sophisticated than current outliners), the physical storage will be handled by the file system, again, so it seems natural to have, to introduce, PROJECT FOLDERS, instead of endlessly trying to gather some disparate files into a special file subset within your outliner - my concept to avoid file linking from within the outliner, and to replace it with folder linking, will resolve almost all possible synching problems that today seem to be virtually insoluble (for details please refer to my previous posts).

Sidestep: We know there are some file managers who introduce “virtual folders”. The problem here is that the CONTENT of these folders is not transferable, so you are STUCK to the file manager in question, and this is enough said to prove that this is not a viable concept. No, the replication has NOT to be made within your outliner; it has NOT to be made within any of your paid file managers: It has to be made within the file system itself, to a project folder, and to which then, in your file system, in your outliner, or from anywhere else, there will be references to this project folder: Don’t do your core work in 3 places concurrently, then hoplessly try to synch: Do it once: There, where the core work is to be done… and then refer to that “first-level” container.

Idem for web sites and everything: Don’t try to import them into an outliner, import them into a project folder, but have that project folder’s every content READY within your relevant outliner context, or wherever you could need it (which might be TheBrain, some mind manager item, or wherever it pleases you).

And now let me tell you something really nasty, but TB people ARE nasty, so my hint will not harm business of kind people, which they are provably not:

Their free edition allows for linking to just ONE target, per item… but if you follow my above advice, you will quickly get that you will not have to buy or rent their 250 dollar-or-whatever-it-might-be-now “professional” edition, at least not for its file linking features.

Posted by Dominik Holenstein
Nov 23, 2013 at 09:50 PM

I had this idea more than ten years ago and it is a very obvious and self-evident.

Dominik

Posted by 22111
Nov 26, 2013 at 02:17 PM

This is very good for you, Dominik, and now show us where you shared your idea for us lesser people (the link please) - I might have been late to the game, but I shared my idea as soon as I got it, and that’s all the difference between anal-retenders and people wanting to make advance things for others.

But then, all I ever read about the subject was something in the line of “unfortunately, the free edition just allows for linking to ONE file, so you must buy one of their paid versions in order to get more” - but then again, perhaps I overlooked your kind sharing of knowledge.

And then, somebody explain to me why in the Windows outliners world, links to groups seems to be an unknow concept, whilst for Mac users, this does not seem to be that far and away:

Again from Prof. Kühn’s blog, a goldmine for links (if not for new immediate insights, except from the links then), I got to this fine example of making fruit of a large screen, for a DEVONthink deployment:

http://jostwald.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/screen-shot-2013-09-12-at-4-53-38-pm.png

And there were numerous passages that intrigued me, the author (in September 2013) amply speaking of assigning individual items to GROUPS:

http://jostwald.wordpress.com/2013/09/13/devonthink-revisited/

And of course, that is firmly related to what I’ve been saying here, some days ago, but also a year ago or so, here, or in any other of the fori I sometimes post in, that the general-adopted concept of linking to individual files should be replaced by linking to dedicated sub-folders (into which you collect clones of files, per project or other grouping aspect); and of course again, this is related to grouping-by-tagging, too, cf. my explanations on possible disadvantages of tagging here and on DC - but there is certainly room for fruitful discussion, both concepts, outlining and tagging, not having been to their respective limits at this time.

I have some regrets about Macs: I decided agains Macs and in favor to Windows some decennials ago and when I wasn’t able to bear the outrageous Mac prices; in those times, I went to “Artline” (totally buggy, but then FreeHand, from Aldus then, became available even for Windows), and to the equally totally buggy Corel Ventura (but which had the advantage of allowing for extensive mark-up coding), before adopting later versions of PageMaker: later on, it was PageMaker again, but with later versions of FreeHand (then Macromedia, then Adobe), and of Illustrator, even (to which I never became get used to).

This being said, it is evident that the same phenomenon that applied to vector graphics and dtp sw in ancient times, continues to work onto most sw today: Mac sw is, by far, the smarter one. So sometimes, I “reinvent the wheel”, by pure lack of knowledge, since some years ago, I read the then-living “just another mac outliner application” site, or what it was called, “asap.com” or something like that - unfortunately, they stopped their work, but it was undeniably one of the best sites for people interested in outliners (and they seem to be always online with their outdating content, it’s just that I don’t remember the name).

Today, if I had to do redo my decision then, I’d “go for” Mac, but as said, in the meanwhile, I have not only “collected” numerous, legit (and non-transferabale) Windows versions of lots of sw, but I also am quite inventive in Windows scripting and Windows “programming” (even when it’s a fact that my Windows “programming” knowledge is very restrained, thus restricting my programming on this side of my design wishes) - and I am not young anymore, so I will have to cope with what Windows has to offer to me, but I perfectly understand young people / university students of today who in some countries, in their majority, “go for” (portable) Macs - most of them do it for the wrong reasons, since Macs are “cool” and show that their parents got “means”, i.e. that they “come from the right stable” - but in the end, they do perfectly well.

So I beg your pardon to everyone if here and there, I offer some idea as “new” that within the Mac sw world has been realized before - I simply don’t know it; I’ve never presented any stolen idea in my life, as being mine - I simply don’t need to fall back on others’ ideas, you see.

But even for people who don’t try to be constructive as I do, and who don’t try to “further things” as I do, there’s a good lesson to be learned: Don’t aggress people when you’re so blatantly, obviously wrong.

Steve Jobs called himself an a**h***, but he was smart. Don’t be a dumb a**h***.

Back to topic list