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Writing tools for complex storytelling
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Posted by JBfrom
Feb 27, 2012 at 01:39 PM
That was a good post, Alex.
I know I haven’t been doing much with Cyborganize lately… real life commitments and health issues have interfered. It looks like I’ll have more time to devote to it, coming up.
This is definitely one of those Cyborganize conceptual moments, though. I’ve been following the discussion without commenting, because I find the issue fascinating.
I think, ultimately, it’s a case of the “wrong question,” as so often happens.
Here’s the question: I have multiple “storylines” or threads or whatever that I want to weave together. So I need a program that helps me manage their separate paths and intersections.
This sounds like a seductive idea. But then you start trying to create it in software/text reality, and the nightmares just never stop.
Why is that?
Well, step back for a moment and consider what text, thought, writing, really is.
Answer: it’s dense, interconnected, overlapping, wildly rich, connections going everywhere all the time - an insanely dense web. Trying to draw the conceptual interconnections in your average 10k body of text is an exponential nightmare.
So you’re never going to successfully represent all those interconnections using your software, short of access to Turing-level AI. You have to satisfice, to stop somewhere.
Given that you have to stop somewhere anyway, my feeling is that it’s almost always better to stick with a hierarchical outline structure, rather than interwebbing. It keeps navigation and categorization simple. Sticking to a modular structure permits much easier manipulation and evolution.
My feeling is that you should leave the web-work to the text itself. Rewrite from different angles for each storyline. Hash out the interconnections in a separate space. Chunk it down into manageable cognitive tasks. Use manually generated diagrams and such. But don’t trust your software to automatically do that stuff for you. Your brain will handle it better. Keep the text workflow simple and straightforward.
Now, maybe I’m wrong. I don’t write multi-threaded fiction storylines, and I haven’t tried Scrivener.
I did give CT a look, and hated the idea of writing text in markup. Org-mode is the most markup typing I’m willing to tolerate.
Posted by Dr Andus
Mar 20, 2012 at 10:21 PM
Interesting that no one had suggested ConnectedText for dealing with my problem of managing multiple story lines (i.e. being able to write/extract a surface text that weaves together multiple story lines, without having to write out all the underlying story lines in full). As I’m slowly learning about CT, I have just discovered the “including parts of topics” feature, which means that I can extract passages from underlying documents and incorporate them in one single “surface” document.
So for example I can analyse my material in a document and then write up my main ideas about the material in the conclusion of that document. Let’s say I’ve done that for 5 story lines. Then I can create a new top level document and simply gather all the Conclusions sections into that new document. Later on even this composite “Conclusions” document can be incorporated in another, higher level document, until eventually the final draft emerges (almost through a “bubbling up” process). Similarly, any other sections of those story lines could be incorporated in the top level (surface) text.
The syntax to carry out these inclusions is ((TopicName==HeaderName)), where the first part is the name of the document where the target section is, and the second part is the name of the header under which the target section is kept. So you just type that somewhere, and bingo, the target section is pulled up and included.
Posted by Cassius
Mar 20, 2012 at 11:58 PM
Gary,
You are absolutely right!!! Too many people are trying use technology to replace THOUGHT. PIMs are good for storing information, whether it be descriptions and names of characters or chemical formulas. Use a voice recorder to help one think aloud or to use as a reminder of sudden ideas but I’m not sure they are needed to flesh out the ideas unless one “thinks aurally” rather than “visually.” I really can’t see transcribing long, voice recorded passages unless they are actual manuscript passages.
-c
Gary Carson wrote:
>After trying every outliner, timeliner, mind-mapping application and “writer’s
>program” ever created, not to mention things like old-fashioned index cards, I’ve
>decided that there is no good solution to this problem. SuperNoteCard and Storylines
>by Writer’s Cafe are probably the best programs for this kind of work, IMO, but the
>truth is that NOTHING works all that well. The bottom line is that this is just hard
>mental work, no matter what tools you’re using. There’s no escaping it.
>
>Actually,
>planning books with multiple, interwoven storylines isn’t all that difficult
>conceptually. You just work out the storylines, break them into chapters, then weave
>the chapters together, alternating between storylines and tying them together as
>you go. When it comes to keeping track of the details where the storylines overlap, you
>just have to keep track of them when you’re writing your chapter outlines. That’s
>really what it boils down to. It’s brain-busting work and it always will be.
>
>One
>method that works OK for me when I’m trying to figure out a complex plot is to write “cue
>outlines.” These are very high-level outlines where I just use a couple words to
>remind me of what the chapter is about and note down the kinds of details you’re talking
>about. I usually write these in Word (or sometimes on a manual typewriter, depending
>on how hostile to computers I am at the time). It helps give me an overall view of the plot
>and how the different storylines fit together.
>
>Dictation also works pretty well.
>It’s great for brainstorming ideas and it’s a lot faster than writing at the keyboard.
>If I’m just brainstorming, I never bother transcribing or saving the dictation
>because the whole point of the exercise is to come up with ideas. You can use dictation
>to create regular outlines as well and transcribe them with Dragon Naturally
>Speaking. Then you can go over the outlines and revise them. It works for me, but it
>might not work for you. Whatever method you use, though, the bottom line is that this is
>all head work. The hardest part of writing is coming up with good ideas and no program is
>going to help you there.