Forum Posts Feed
A word on Surfulater (today on Bits du Jour)
< Next Topic | Back to topic list | Previous Topic >
Posted by Neville Franks
May 31, 2007 at 01:50 AM
Please see below.
Bob Mackreth wrote:
>That’s another good thing about Surfulater- an active and accessible author, who
>pays attention to user feedback.
>
>But I do have to agree with Cassius to a certain
>extent: if I recall correctly, the demo version I downloaded would not allow me to
>create a new knowledge base, and trial users are locked out of several of the support
>forums.
>
>If you’re going to time-limit a demo version, then why cripple it? Some of us
>like to put a program through its paces to see if it’s going to work for our needs.
Unlike other software we allow the Surfulater Free Trial to be restarted at any time, as documented on our FAQ page. Allowing new Knowledge Bases to be created could potentially enable folks to continue using Surfulater forever by restarting the trial, hence this restriction was put in place.
No other features are disabled or restricted in any way in the trial and the sample knowledge base content can be deleted or just simply added to. So I never considered not allowing new KB’s to be created as being too onerous and was a reasonable tradeoff to allow the trial to be restarted.
Having said all of that I do plan to see if this restriction can be removed.
>And
>keeping trial users out of support forums seems downright
>counter-productive.
There is a Pre-Sales Surfulater forum that anyone can read, post on and get replies. The Surfulater Customer forums are provided as an added-value area for paying customers. They also provide an area where product direction and development are discussed away from the eyes of potential competitors.
Neville Franks
Posted by Neville Franks
May 31, 2007 at 02:00 AM
Most secure HTTPS pages can only be retrieved once from the Web Server. To demonstrate this click Refresh in your Web Browser and you will usually get an error. This is the reason Surfulater can’t download “some” https pages.
When you use IE as your Web Browser Surfulater has smarts that enable https pages to be saved without having to download them from their Web Server. We may add this capability for Firefox in the future.
However the best way to save such https pages is simply to use Edit|Select All (Ctrl+A) on the Web page and then use: Surfulater: Add new Article. This will always work.
I’m surprised to hear that Mybase can save HTTPS pages that Surfulater can’t. Can you please post the URL for such a page, so I can see whats going on. Thanks.
Neville Franks.
Cassius wrote:
>More on Surfulater vs myBase:
>
>1. Wes pointed out that Surfulator, like mB, can have
>multiple databases open.
>
>2. Surfulator says, “Secure HTTPS pages can’t be added as
>Attachments. This isn’t a Surfulater problem and is due to the nature of secure pages.
>Instead select the content you wish to save and use Surfulater: Add new Article in your
>Browser.”
>
>MyBase CAN save such pages. (I just did it.)
>
>-c
>
Posted by Neville Franks
May 31, 2007 at 02:12 AM
Please see below.
Cassius wrote:
>Wes,
>
>Thanks for the info. I followed the instructions and was able to actually get
>the trial to work! With the very limited time I had to test Surfulater, it appears
>that:
>
>1. Surfulater does a better job of copying highlighted text+images from a Web
>page into Surfulater than does myBase. With mB one has to paste images
>separately.
>
>2. Since Microsoft revised Hotmail, mB can no longer save entire
>Hotmail email pages from either Firefox or IE7. Surfulater apparently can, but it has
>to open them in an external browser.
The ability to (optionally) display attached Web pages within Surfulater is on our todo list.
>3. mB can edit saved Web pages in its internal
>browser. Surfulater cannot since it opens saved pages in an external browser. As a
>workaround, one apparently can highlight all of a Web page, copy it to the clipboard,
>and then save it to Surfulater. The saved clipping can then be edited in
>Surfulator.
You can do Edit|Select All (Ctrl+A) then Surfulater|Add New Article to grab the entire page and include it inside a Surfulater Article, which can subsequently be edited. There is no need to copy it to the clipboard. You can append content to an article using the Surfulater Clipboard Hotkeys.
When we add the ability to display attached Web pages in Surfulater we may also add editing capabilities.
>4. Thus, in mB one immediately sees a saved Web page. In Surfulater, one
>only sees it after it is opened in an external browser, or if one has copied it to the
>clipboard and thence to Surfulater. Both allow one to see the current, possibly
>changed, version of the page.
See my earlier comment.
>5 mB has more formatting features than
>Surfulater.
What extra formatting features do you need?
>6. mB saves pages virtually instantly; Surfulater sometimes takes
>what seems like several seconds.
If you use IE as your Web Browser attached Web pages are saved very quickly. Also if you acquire selected content from a Web page it is very fast.
>7.In mB, one can have more than one database open at
>the same time. One selects which by using tabs or CTRL-TAB. It appears that one can only
>have one Surfulater database open at a time.
You can have as many KB’s open as you want in Surfulater.
>8.mB has indexed file search and the
>ability to remove “recycle” (i.e. “undo”) items. I did not see these in
>Surfulater.
Undo is planned. Search is very fast as is. Indexed search may be added in future however.
>9.One can optimize the mB file size. I don’t know if Surfulater can do
>this. I could not compare file sizes because the Surfulater trial version does not
>permit the creation of new files.
>
>10. Both programs have some “ease-of-use”
>features, but each has some that the others lack. The same is true for some advanced
>features.
>
>11. I am about to suggest to Bits du Jour that it also offer mB in the near
>future.
>
>12. I did take`advantage of the BdJ discount, and will further test the full
>version of Surfulater as time permits.
>
>-Cassius
>===========(see below)
>
>Wes
>Perdue wrote:
>>Cassius,
>>
>>You wrote:
>>>Well, I’ve tried the Surfulater trial
>again. It would not
>>allow me to create a new
>>>article, nor even paste clipboard
>contents into an existing
>>article. In both cases it
>>>told me that these are
>disabled in the trial version.
>>
>>It
>>sounds as if your demo went into read-only
>mode. This short thread on the Surfulater
>>forum seems to describe a similar problem
>and the resolution:
>>
>>Soft As It Gets Forums
>>- Surfulator Crashes loose free
>
>>trial
>>http://www.softasitgets.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1261
>>
>>I
>picked
>>it up at the discounted price today; it’s a really good deal. I hope you can
>complete
>>your trial.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Wes
Neville Franks
Posted by Cassius
May 31, 2007 at 03:07 AM
Neville said, “Most secure HTTPS pages can only be retrieved once from the Web Server. To demonstrate this click Refresh in your Web Browser and you will usually get an error. This is the reason Surfulater can’t download “some” https pages.
“When you use IE as your Web Browser Surfulater has smarts that enable https pages to be saved without having to download them from their Web Server. We may add this capability for Firefox in the future.
“However the best way to save such https pages is simply to use Edit|Select All (Ctrl+A) on the Web page and then use: Surfulater: Add new Article. This will always work.
“I’m surprised to hear that Mybase can save HTTPS pages that Surfulater can’t. Can you please post the URL for such a page, so I can see whats going on. Thanks.”
REPLY: The Web pages in question were prescription refill confirmation pages from http://www.caremark.com. Thus, they no longer exist.
As I said, the ability of S to copy both text and images is a big plus. It almost makes saving Web pages unnecessary. In fact, if this saving ability also saves links, what advantage is there to saving a page as a separate operation?
-cassius
Posted by Bob Mackreth
May 31, 2007 at 03:56 AM
Thanks for popping in Neville, and taking the time to respond.
Just a couple of clarifications:
>>On the down side, the UI is just
>>a bit quirky-
>eg, no “Edit” item in the menu bar, though cut/ copy / paste /undo
>>functions are
>available through toolbar icons or right-click. You can set most font
>>aspects for
>text you enter, but not color. Right-clicking the document icon in the
>>tree pane-
>intuitive for most of us - does not bring up the normal set of choices; you
>>have to
>select the label TEXT instead. Odd!
>
>- What action would “Edit item” actually
>perform? About all I can think of would be to enter edit mode on the Title for the current
>record. There are already plenty of ways to edit content and this seems like adding
>unnecessary clutter to me. Note also that Edit works on a Record -> Field basis
>wherease Cut/Copy/Paste etc. all work on complete records.
You misread my post, specifically reading :
“edit” item on the menu bar
as:
“edit item” on the menu bar
What I was trying to say is that in the vast majority of Windows applications, the menu bar, reading from left to right, will include FILE - EDIT - and then other items specific to the app. (Maybe I should not use the word “item” here, but I can’t think of a better term right now.)
In most other programs when you choose EDIT, the drop-down menu will include choices such as UNDO - REDO - CUT - COPY - PASTE, etc.
I find it a bit odd that Surfulater does not follow this Windows convention. Personally, I like to minimize toolbar clutter, and in most software, I can confidently delete seldom-used buttons from toolbars knowing that, should I ever need to use that command, it will be available from a drop-down menu. This does not seem to be the case with Surfulater.
And while we’re speaking of Windows conventions,
>- Surfulater makes extensive use of right click context menus
>throughout the program. It seemed logical to me at least that right click on an image
>would limit itself to menu items to change the image and right click on the item title
>would provide the full complement of capabilities.
But is it not a Windows convention that when you right-click on an icon, the context menu choices affect the associated file, document, item, whatever? Go to Windows Explorer, for example: right-clicking the file icon will bring up the same context menu as right-clicking the file name.
I find it jarring when I want to cut or copy or delete an article in a knowledge base, and I right-click on the icon as I have learned to do, lo these many years, and the choices that appear are, “Change This Image,” “Restore To Default Image,” and “Set This Item Type’s Default Image.” Seems to me most Windows users will be expecting the CUT- REMOVE - RENAME etc choices here.
> I could also add these to the image context menu, but surely that’s unnecessary clutter. Context menu’s are after all,
>all about what you click on.
Perhaps clutter is in the eye of the beholder. To me a toolbar button for “Select A Content Color Theme” qualifies as clutter; how often do most of us change color themes in the middle of a session?
>Product design and development comprises various
>tradeoffs.
Indeed; I think you’ve done a good job, and I have stated elsewhere that your accessibility and communication with users is a strong point in Surfulater’s favor.