As many in this forum know, Brainstorm creates outlines in a somewhat unusual way, by restricting the topics presented in any given window to a topic and its immediate subordinates. Many who have tried this approach, including me, have found it promotes focus and rigor as well as creativity. The question I want to raise is, speaking ideally,would it be better for an application devoted to creating hierarchical lists to incorporate Brainstorm's manner of functioning as an alternative mode rather than the exclusive means for functioning. Proposals for an enhanced "aerial view" in Brainstorm go part of the way toward this idea, without entirely embracing it.

In fact there are two Windows applications that incorporate this "ultra-hierarchical" technique in a multi-faceted approach to outlining. One is MaxThink, which allows operations on the complete outline but uses a default view like BrainStorm's; the other is ADM, which incorporates a focused view like Brainstorm's as on of various options. I don't think either has the convenience of Brainstorm, although I have not looked at MaxThink closely, being put off by the absence of a manual of any kind (unless you count a list of hotkeys a manual). But I am not now speaking to implementation, but rather I'm asking an "in principle" question.

Stephen R. Diamond

Stephen,

Would you consider hoisting a version of this same approach to focussing on a single subject? If so, NoteMap also provides this facility, and, UltraRecall is scheduled to add hoisting to its next upgrade, I think.

In regards specifically to Brainstorm, I think Marck and David would have to overhaul the interface dramatically to effectively implement the ability to unhoist. Here is why I say that: When you have a long listing of items with several levels of sub items, it is not always easy to tell what level you are looking at without a visual cue. That's why outlines have labeling and level by level formatting. When you see an item with the label "I", "A", "1", "a", "i" or whatever, you get a sense of where you are. Without that, it isn't always obvious what level you are viewing. I think this is way aerial view in Brainstorm isn't as effective as a genuine outline.

So, my opinion is that it wouldn't be worth it for Marck and David to add the unhoisted view without adding some form of identification as to level (text color, might be the easiest way for them to do so). I do think adding navigation to aerial view would be very useful.

Steve Z.

Stephen:

Yes, I think that both hoisting and an active aerial view of the total outline should be combined into outlining aoftware. Indeed, this was always the case with high-end DOS outlining software (e.g., Grandview, Maxthink/DOS). Although a case could be made for distinguishing the "hoisting" phase of outlining from later ones, I think this is probably an artifical one that arises as much from the inadequacies of existing software as from more theoretical considerations.

Maxthink for Windows seems to be more-or-less a porting over of the DOS program, which included hoisting and an active aerial view. It's a pity it's so sluggish, expensive, quirky and unstable, because it probably (in theory) comes closest in Windows to what the DOS programs achieved. I remember its designer as once remarking that he couldn't see the point of developing a Windows version of Maxthink. Indeed, if WIN98 and XP had developed more flexible "DOS boxes" for running DOS programs there would probably have been no need to try.

As for the brainstorming abilities of these original DOS programs, as well as hoisting, in some cases they implemented "throwing" and categorizing. Current Windows programs have a long way to go before they catch up. It is a pity that neither Maxthink/DOS nor Grandview are freely available for download so that current developers could see what the competition is really like.

Derek

Doesn't the function "display only through level 2" accomplish this in all outliners?